There are many red faces in the top corridor at the ‘dream factory’ at Notts Police FHQ following Monday nights screening of ‘Coppers’ on Channel 4, the new ‘fly on the wall’ documentary.
The red faces are not just for the cringe inducing antics of some of Mansfield CID’s finest but mainly due to the completely opposing viewpoints held by the DCC and the ACC.
Back on 29th December 2011, the farce intranet was saying:
” A series of Documentaries will show the ‘true face’ of policing in Nottinghamshire, according to ACC Paul Broadbent”
“ACC Broadbent, who has watched three of the programmes in their final edited stage, focusing on CID, public order issues and Armed response officers, said he was delighted with the finished product”
“What the public of this country will see is a true and honest picture of policing the streets of the city and county. At times it is raw and edgy, at times littered with humour – but at all times shows the problems we encounter on a day-to-day basis and how professional we are at dealing with all manner of incidents, from neighbourly disputes to serious crime”
Contrast that message with the latest offering from DCC Chris Eyre on 11th Jan 2012:
“The excellent work conducted by officers from Mansfield CID has been tarnished by some of the language used and attitudes displayed by some of those officers interviewed in a documentary this week”
“The the foul and derogatory language – particularly in sanitized interview circumstances – was utterly unacceptable and the gallows humour used on camera was hugely insensitive”
“We are monitoring the reaction of the public, own staff and – critically – the Police Authority and our partners who share my extreme disappointment that our officers could portray themselves in this way”
“The documentary has been an eye opener for me. In the coming days I will be
sharing my views about ethics and values very openly with staff and expect we will all play a part in ensuring that we act and speak professionally and with respect for one another and for the public at all times, and that we self police”
ACPO ranks appear to be at loggerheads, sending out conflicting messages.
1st?
Yay, something good today:-) In your face photo boy
Bah humbug. Well done.
Police officers on pay freeze….working 2 days and 4 nights on a rota and often on their own. The following list of job vacancies on the Notts Police web site just speaks volumes for where the likes of Dcc Eyre thinks the important issues lay.
Telephone Interviewer
Infrastructure Services Manager (ICT Directorate)
Service Desk – Team Manager
Management Information Officer
Geographical Information Systems (GIS) Assistant
Operations Engineer – ICT Directorate
Business Analyst/Developer – ICT Directorate
Business Marketing Advisor
Business Relationship and Project Manager
The corporate departments are obviously not subject to cuts. How can this idiot complain about the reality of what happens on the streets when his officers struggle with understaffing and poor command..Are the command in Notts so naive as they cannot remember Thames Vally and the raper interviews and are they really so far removed from reality that they dont know what really goes on in REAL LIFE !!! I think the recent staff opinion surveys speak volumes…IF only the public really knew what a farce these so called leaders are.
DCC /ACC? When did they ever police, when would they have ever known what it was like at the coal face? Ignore them.
Have no fear comrade most of us do!
1st
Sounds fantastic
/sarcasm
Maybe
top ten again
top five even!
They need to get the same hymn sheet organised.
Feel sorry for the officers who will undoubtable be hung out to dry.
Top 1000
Never try to ride the tiger that is the media. It will turn and eat you. Never agree to participate in documentaries. In my line of work (I could tell you what it is, but I would have to then summon a helpful ARV and convince the guys to shoot you) it is absolutely verboten to talk to media types, precisely because the company’s message can be confused/compromised.
Agreed. More ‘above and beyond’ and ‘can do’ from front-line officers (agreeing to take part in such programs), which is just not worth it. Cover your arses, lads and lasses, don’t put your necks on the line like this, as with everything else there’s no top cover when mistakes are made or it goes bandy. You wouldn’t get me on one of these programs for all the Cannabis Warnings in Peckham.
Yeah, your right. Sky TV set compass bearing north to do some filming in the tundra in the early nineties when I was there. The shift inspector almost had a fit when they said they wanted to come out on a night shift Friday when I just happened to be rostered for shift. The quickest of re arranging took place and they were sent out with an ex Pongo Bandy that use to wear a scarf on foot patrol before he was transferred to the Tufty Club. I’m glad though it wasn’t me, as I would have been in a world of shit even sooner that I was. Only by six months mind you. Sky didn’t get any footage though. This is another first class post from IG exposing the REMFY crap that operational officers (and some MILF PCSO’s bye the way) have to constantly watch their backs for. This evening, I am going to write a letter of appreciation to Notts Police and the Police Authority saying that it was refreshing to see Officers being open and forthright and obviously at ease doing so in such a public forum, which in my humble opinion only goes to further the reputation of operational police officers.
The E-mail exchanges that go on between the higher up officers involved in the screening of these types of shows often makes for interesting reading. FOI can be a wonderful tool sometimes.
First
I must say I quivered a little when I saw the drunk being pushed over, not good PR, but it was mostly a good programme.
Gallows humour? Has he ever had to pick up bits of people from train lines or collisions? If you didn’t try have a laugh with each other you’d go mad (or madder than we already are). What a circular door opening device.
First to laugh at this comment.
See what I did there?
The gallows humour last night was in very poor taste and certainly showed, an Inspector no less, in a very poor light. Even holding his tue up at the side of his neck as if hanging some of the people. More so when the individuals were sad cases with serious health and mental issues.
Yes we do have a black sense of humour but it is for behind closed doors and in private.
A fly on the wall documentary is meant to show what happens behind closed doors, isn’t it?
“A fly on the wall documentary is meant to show what happens behind closed doors, isn’t it”
Only if you’re a ****ing idiot or a show-off!
Bill.
……. or, if not, a ****ing hypocrite.
I think he made the hanging by tie gesture, as if to say ‘whats the point, the police are doomed’, not stringing up the public!
I thought he and the majority of all the officers seen on the programme so far, have been brutally honest in telling it like it is.
I sit and do that twisty mouth thing, thinking to myself “yep, looks like its the same crack all over the country, not just where i work”.
At least it shows coppers as actual humans, not the politically correct, get the word community into every sentence, remf’s that reside in coward castle (hq)
He was imitating suicide at the pointlessness of it all, not saying other people should be hanged!
100 % correct mr gadget
That was my impression too. Hadn’t occurred to me that it was interpreted as anything else until visiting this thread. Should have known better really.
As an Inspector it was in very poor taste and did not give any good impression.
But if he was a PC it would have been ok…..?
People are so easy to offend. They need to google what HTFU means.
I disagree. It shows he hasn’t lost touch, yet.
He was simulating hanging himself, as if to say “I have to deal with the same underclass dross every day” – he wasn’t suggesting that we hang MoPs.
I appreciate the honesty issuing forth from the officers. The public generally have no idea what we do. I certainly didn’t (and still don’t really as I’m a spesh) but having been wearing the uniform for a while now I can totally see why the dark humour is necessary. Most people I imagine have some sort of laugh at work – why should police be any different?
as an MOP, I thought all of the episodes so far have shown the police in a really good light. The gallows humour has been entirely appropriate under the circumstances. The main factor that makes ‘Coppers’ better and more watchable than the ‘cops with cameras’ shows that are on most of the time is that you get the impression – rightly or wrongly – that they’re saying what they really think; not what they think they ought to say/have been told to say/their press liaison has told them to say.
And as an MOP who has worked in PR for years, it’s brilliant publicity at a time when the public perception of the police has taken a knock. True, some of it won’t win you any recruits, but the fact is that the people getting the really bad publicity are the ‘regular clients’. I would lay money most people watching come away thinking “I didn’t realise how much s*** the poor old rozzers have to deal with. Wouldn’t catch me doing that. Good on them.”
I never realised how much being a Spesh would change me, to the point where I’m now beginning a full time gaoler.
I’ve either become;
A) Job pissed wierdo.
or
B) So disillusioned with the outside world that going full time with the job will keep me sane…
OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH PLEASE!
*beginning as
@Soon to be Mr. “Even holding his tue up at the side of his neck as if hanging some of the people.”
I am at odds with your interpretation. I watched that and took that as a sign of the Inspector hanging himself out of frustration on what he and his officers face on a daily basis.
I also thought that he was a fool for doing such a thing on camera.
ok 11th then…
not seen this week’s episode yet and as a member of the public who is pro police but not unconditionally, it did serve to highlight that some individuals on the force may have brought the service into disrepute. I support Nick Manning. He provided the information we deserve to know.
This tv series was about giving an accurate insight into what it’s like being a police officer in 21st century Britain. The trouble is it did exactly that !!!!! Notts Police’s CCMT should have realised that is what they were letting themselves in for. Other police “Fly on the wall” documentries have had exactly the same affect. The MOPs discover we’re only human, with the same personality pitfalls as anybody else. Is there a problem with the public knowing that we’re just people as well??? We all know that the public think we all live in boxes in the police station, and don’t live like “normal” people.
The only issue I had was the Worksop Neighbourhood Team officer describing himself as “The new sheriff in town”. What a plonker !!!!!
Ah ha, top twenty……….
Top 20 Woop woop.
Missed that one, it is repeated and I have it
Ready to record.
This is what you get when tutor constables are still in their probation and sergeants are promoted on diversity and the corporate bullshine message they have to spout. No experience necessary.
Absolutely.
That just sums it up nicely.
First 30
Must admit that the “Powertool” waving bit was cringeworthy.
I have watched all of these so far and there does seem to be the ‘push people out the way to make them move on’ approach being used on more than one occasion.
Whether this is part of the training or not I don’t know but I can see why it would raise a few eyebrows.
On the other hand it does show some of the idiots that waste so much resource on a daily basis and some of the stuff that people call up about is just daft.
Society really is in a mess but then people who dont to anything wrong will never appear on TV…
could it possibly be that pushing people away is an intermediate action between verbal command and arrest in the continuum of force?
A step intended to reinforce the direction to leave without having to arrest a drunk troublemaker (thus losing the war of attrition by tying officers up with a trivial prisoner for hours) who is at the time unwilling or unable to comprehend the direction to move on?
An action taken to prevent a breach of the peace which falls short of arrest?
If pushing away is prohibited, what are the alternatives?
to clarify, not what I’d have done. There is old wisdom to which I subscribe that says ‘if you lay hands on someone, they’re nicked.’
Confused a bit with your post Chewie are you saying you wouldn’t ever push some drunken scrote away if they got in your personal space or needed some incentive to ‘do one’ down the road? …. you either do nothing or you nick them? ….
A good question ML.
I’m not a ‘do nothing’ kind of chap and have a pile of 163s to prove it.
It depends on the circumstances. There are plenty of circumstances where pushing is appropriate.
Would I pursue a trappy drunk up the road and push him several times, then put his coat over his head, with a film crew up my chuff …. no.
You don’t know if it’s part of the training. What seat have you been shining, and why don’t you know!
Under 30
I have never – ever – understood why any police officer with even half a brain cell would voluntarily talk with the media.
They are NOT our friends.
In general they are indolent unprincipled hacks who seek to sensationalise the negative and use the words ‘blunder’ and ‘bungle’ every time something does not go perfectly from start to finish.
It is beyond me why anyone would co-operate with these buffoons. I certainly never have, and never will.
There is utterly no hope of a fair and balanced representation from any journalist or documentary maker. None.
I scoff at anyone who is filmed on a voluntary basis and pity anyone who is somehow forced to participate.
There is no potential benefit from being filmed, and a myriad of unpleasant potential consequences. They aren’t looking for heroism, they’re anything to criticise.
I can only hope the ‘Reality TV; generation of coppers get over their ‘Celebrity Cop-Factor’ fantasies and refuse to go anywhere near film crews.
Letting these backstabbing hacks ‘inside’ doesn’t help control their output at all – it just makes it easier for them to edit out all the good work we do and concentrate on the few errors in judgement, language or action that must surely be expected from operational activity without benefit of scripts, editing and multiple ‘takes.’
The press is proven to damage policing. This is nothing new – Napoleon once said that “four hostile newspapers are more to be feared than a thousand bayonets.”
Co-operation with the media is self-destructive. Let them do their damage from a distance.
hear hear, if ‘Coppers’ or some or rubbish TV show was coming to my nick I would book the week off sick. If you can bet your money on one thing its that no matter if you talked someone off a bridge or saved a bus full of newborn babies from crashed the media will always make you look the worst.
I am not some sort of fun-killer and lord knows I am the first to joke around, but the last place I would do it was in front of a TV camera.
Having once been stitched up by a sleeze-bag TV interviewer who lied to me about what he was going to ask, then, when we went live, asked a totally different question, I sympathise with your viewpoint. I was like a rabbit in the headlights.
This series seriously re-inforces the public’s negative image of the police. But we already knew that this has been down to the EU -> NuLab-> LibCon-> ACPO ……… and not the front-liners chasing stupid targets, thus laying the blame on Parliament itself.
You should be happy with that.
I am not a plod, and I genuinely think that the series bolsters support for the ridiculous situation in which you find yourselves as social workers etc.etc.
SMT and the troops always get hoist by the media petard, Stupid SMT for agreeing to the series. Naive troops, for performing to order, only to ge stamped on afterwards by professionally offended SMT who, too late, are having second thoughts about the original great idea.
Totally agree. Well said.
so, you naively volunteer to do a fly-on-the-wall police documentary, and in doing so give the media your face and name.
Some years later, you write off an on-test expensive pursuit car … off toddles a Daily Maul hack to check the database, and bingo!
“The policeman who wrecked a £40,000 supercar on a test drive has been unveiled as the former star of a police TV show.
Pc Paul Fletcher was at the wheel of a Volkswagen Golf R – which has a top speed of 155mph – when it crashed during a trial in Manchester at 2am, writing the Golf off.”
Never, ever expose yourself or your details to the media. You have no control over what they choose to do with it, and they’ll hurt you every chance they get.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2092245/Car-Wars-Policeman-Paul-Fletcher-wrecks-40k-supercar-test-drive.html
Totally agree. The media follow a heavy format of: ‘Bungled(ing)’, ‘swoops’, ‘bundling into vans’, counting of officers, cars, ‘riot’ vans, and/or police helicopters involved in incidents (as a means of assessing the incidents importance/unimportance and therefore ‘overkill’).
They will make things up, and yet never correct themselves when proved wrong (remember the underground tunnels Moat used when he was ‘hiding directly under the police’s feet’ that he never entered).
The BBC ran an article on the unhealthy relationship between SOME members of the press, and THE police. I don’t know about you lot, but I’m always being wined and dined by journos pressing me for info about Chantelle’s text war with Tiffnee, Dogshitgate, or the most recent (pointless) pub carpark shoving match…..
Police constable’s public communications to the press corps should be politically correct to avoid post-communication public comments that are professionally compromising.
In short, PCs’ PCs to the PC should be PC to avoid PC PCs that are PC.
top 30
recount – there are only 17 names… top 20 even
Am I in spam-trap purgatory?
I have never – ever – understood why any police officer with even half a brain cell would voluntarily talk with the media.
They are NOT our friends.
In general they are indolent unprincipled hacks who seek to sensationalise the negative and use the words ‘blunder’ and ‘bungle’ every time something does not go perfectly from start to finish.
It is beyond me why anyone would co-operate with these buffoons. I certainly never have, and never will.
There is utterly no hope of a fair and balanced representation from any journalist or documentary maker. None.
I scoff at anyone who is filmed on a voluntary basis and pity anyone who is somehow forced to participate.
There is no potential benefit from being filmed, and a myriad of unpleasant potential consequences. They aren’t looking for heroism, they’re anything to criticise.
I can only hope the ‘Reality TV; generation of coppers get over their ‘Celebrity Cop-Factor’ fantasies and refuse to go anywhere near film crews.
Letting these backstabbing hacks ‘inside’ doesn’t help control their output at all – it just makes it easier for them to edit out all the good work we do and concentrate on the few errors in judgement, language or action that must surely be expected from operational activity without benefit of scripts, editing and multiple ‘takes.’
The press is proven to damage policing. This is nothing new – Napoleon once said that “four hostile newspapers are more to be feared than a thousand bayonets.”
Co-operation with the media is self-destructive. Let them do their damage from a distance.
Quite right Chewie.
These parasite “fly on the wall” documentary makers are taking advantage of free actors to make money for their shareholders with minimal outlay.
The police need to be equally mercenary, if there is nothing in it for the police to give information to TV, radio or newspapers then don’t do it.
Don’t be fooled by the bleating of the Media Relations types at FHQ, the news media need you much more than you need them.
Top 25 yeah!!!
Alright I know that’s pushing it…
Honestly, what a load of crap. So police officers swear and aren’t always flattering about people who constantly break the law, surely not a surprise to many.
The PC who pushed the drunk looked a bit heavy handed, but I wasn’t there, I haven’t seen what went before, I don’t know his previous – who am I to judge?
I assumed the point of the programme was a ‘warts and all’ look at policing for people who aren’t in the job, not a propaganda tool for ACPO.
I thought it looked a bit much – three shoves I think before the bloke landed on his arse. I commented at the time of watching that he’d probably be best off locking the bloke up now as he’s used a fair bit of force on him. My family agrees and they are very pro police. To my eye it looked like he has just lost patience with the guy, ending up putting his coat over his head whilst handcuffed. Didn’t look great, but i agree that we didn’t see it all beforehand so aren’t best placed to judge.
Pushing is from 15:30
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGIYy094JaE
Having watched the pushing:
Not how I would have dealt with it but: cleaning up the streets can be a messy business and it doesn’t always look pretty. This fool thought he could treat the police like mugs.
Let that happen once to often in front of the others and you get Tottenham.
“The fool thought he could treat the police like mugs.”
I haven`t watched the clip but I`m going to disagree with the boss (sorry).
What I`ve seen on British cop documentaries (and those high profile media cases have shown) is examples of cops losing their cool and taking things personally.
Now, I don`t have an issue with that. As long as what the offender is doing is actually that, personal, and not just a general ‘winding up’ of the nearest copper.
Circumstances will vary of course, I know that, but telling someone to move along, and them not doing it as quickly as you want isn`t grounds to feel personally slighted and lash out. It isn`t you personally they are defying.
I accept what you said about how this defiance can inflame a crowd and encourage others.
I regularly have those “Oh, for f*cks sake!” moments at work, and would have liked to strangle/slap/shove a few people.
But as another commenter said, if you have to put your hands on them then they`re nicked.
I`m not allowed to get hands on and I can`t nick people (not properly) ‘cos I`m a civ. But you guys (and girls) aren`t civvies, you`re coppers, an office and a calling that demands something higher.
And on that subject…
Couldn`t someone have nicked Balotelli the other night? Has anyone ever heard of a sportsperson being arrested in the middle of a game?
“What I`ve seen on British cop documentaries (and those high profile media cases have shown) is examples of cops losing their cool and taking things personally.”
Really. And you base this on what?
CITC
IF you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
But make allowance for their doubting too;
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don’t deal in lies,
Or being hated, don’t give way to hating,
And yet don’t look too good, nor talk too wise
This would be you I take it. I think not! And no, it’s not them personally they’re defying it is a Police Officer.
Perhaps he should have done as he was told and fucked off after the first verbal command, rendering the pushes un-necessary?
Episode is here if you missed it:
I liked the programme. I see a lot of corporate police speak in my job and I thought it was refreshing to see police officers talk candidly. The public aren’t mugs, we do not expect officers to behave like robots.
I think this will be the last…. PSD will make sure of that.
Gallows humour is a far better way of releasing the tensions and stress of having to remain calm and collected when having to face things which normal human instinct says to avoid at all costs.
Thats why gallows humour is endemic in most lines of work were danger, injury and death, including to others, is the daily norm. It is found throughout the emergency services, the armed forces and the medical, amongst others, as a method of coping and retaining at least some sanity.
It is far preferable than some of the alternatives such as lapsing into deep depression, manic depression or escapism through alcohol or prescription drug abuse. Given the choice, and from experience, I’d go for gallows humour, however much it offends those of a more delicate disposition, every time. To hell with them, stay sane.
yes of course I would say Gallows Humour is preferable to turning to booze, but not in front of the TV camera.
Why not in front of a TV camera? The whole point is to try to show *what it’s actually like” then that can only be achieved with total honesty from the participants.
Could you even make a documentary featuring only ACPO approved speech patterns? Would you be able to have any humans involved at all or would it be manikins (individualakins) with speakers on their heads, reading policy in monotone.
I like the program, i recognise much of what i do and what i face in it.
If the Police dont like what the police do and how the police act then perhaps they need to look at their name badge and see what it says there.
I have a new job.
My manager called us all in to a meeting today. He said “this won’t be pleasant” and then said “me and certain people will soon be having some very unpleasant conversations. They know who they are”.
On my way home tonight I passed his office and asked if any of the problem was due to the 10 newbies, myself included, that they’d just taken on. He smiled and went “no, before your time. The people I referred to…they know that I know who they are. But you don’t”.
He then made it clear that he would never tell me who these people were but I should rest assured that it wasn’t me. We then chatted about Conn Iggulden’s “Emperor” novels for 5 minutes and I went home.
At no point did he or even his SMT, try to villify anyone or make a sacrifice of some poor guy to prove a point. I get the impression that this will be dealt with internally and I will probably NEVER find out the issues involved let alone who was responsible for whatever the issues were. I am damn certain the public will also never find out.
The sense of honour and decency that management seemed to have back in the day seems to have now vanished into the ether with regard to the Police.
Notts’ DCC is a phallic toy from the Anne Summer catalogue with veins up the sides, the size of a baby’s forearm.
*2nd attempt, may appear twice.
Correct – such management skills are non existent in the police. Largely, because the promotion process consists purely of A) Passing an exam about law (fair enough) but then B) Developing some new inspirational idea to show the radical ideas you will bring to the farce.
Unfortunately B tends to be difficult to do, so the wheel is re-invented with bosses implementing various “procedures” or “policies” which do little to enhance the quality of policing and quite often reduce it by wasting police officers time ticking boxes so that said boss can then sit in interview and spout about how effective their great idea was, and therefore get their promotion.
Or the other route, is usually to find a police officer that has done something wrong and stick them on papers – a great example of managing conflict / staff problems for interview. Of course, good management would be to bring that officer in, talk about the issue and develop them somehow, but strangely this rarely happens – i’m willing to bet it gets cited a lot at interviews though as “the officer went away aware of his issues and, while not happy, was content with the respect manner he/she was treated…”
Each boss has their own agenda, set at reviews, where targets (that no longer exist) are set. I am aware of different bosses in my force that have “non targets” for detections, number of RJ’s, Improved victim contact and many others…
The answer to this from the bosses – new “procedures” are brought in. These are usually a form of some sort to enable the bosses to monitor that things are being done correctly. Of course, this isn’t done by the boss themselves, therefore you have a PC, Sgt, or even Inspector responsible for collecting and analysing the data from these forms…
The bosses then send numerous emails out, usually through the screening Sgt / Inspector that form x y and z must be done, x amount of times a month or else, meaning the bobbies and sgt’s underneath are pulled in a thousand directions, chasing targets, that no longer exist, because the Home Secretary said they don’t… and all the time these forms are being filled, thats an officer not available to attend an incident, or to pro-actively target areas and stopping crimes from happening.
Of course, a better option may be to identify the jobs that have gone wrong / corners been cut – identify the officers who are repeatedly making the mistakes, and speak to them directly about it, but this never seems to happen, presumably it is easier to affect everyone enmasse.
It is not all doom and gloom out there – there are some very good bosses still out there, but there’s a higher percentage of idiots, unfortunately.
Bobbies, for the most part, care about their job and really do try to make a difference in our own small way. Unfortunately, red tape, beauracracy and number crunching, tend to get in the way.
The Sergeant who bullied me out of the J.O.B made special note in his “retrospective justification now the little turd has gone blubbing to the Chief Inspector” notes (about a meeting where he sat there smiling while I was crying) that, after accompanying him back to the main building “PC Javelin Masculine shook my hand just before we parted company”.
This was apparently to illustrate that I had not taken offence to 135 minutes of humiliating bullying he had just put me through and had in fact left thinking he was worthy of a hand shake.
Errr…he was my Sergeant and we were at Force HQ. I was trying to muster a thing called “dignity” despite looking like I had just watched Old Yeller and been sprayed with a whole tin of CS.
One example of why no-one should be allowed to be a skipper without at least 5 year’s in (he took his after 3 apparently…one year after probation. Gimmee strength).
Hold on sweetheart.
I took and passed my skippers at 2.5 years, as did my best mate.
I agree that length of service and experience is a big factor in making a good sergeant, but the point at which someone passes an exam is irrelevant.
I’ll take you at your word that Sgt Kerwan was indeed a “Kerwan” and I think bullying is dreadful.
He became a skipper at 3 years, not just part 1.
Inspector Har wood made Guv in 6 years and is one of the best Sirs I ever met.
I think this should be an objective rule. 5 years minimum before promotion. Although you may take Skipper and Guv exams earlier, as ammo for when you pass that mark.
I knew an acting CI (the Bronx Warriors guy) who made that rank after 6 years. Has now left the J.O.B due to stress and anxiety.
Wat’s wrong with 5 years? I am fast approaching the magic 30 and still out there nicking the underclass almost daily. What I get fed up with are a few custody skippers here and there with very little EXPERIENCE and even less service trying to supervise me naively and often only able to quote from Butterworths or Blackstones etc. we need experienced supervisors!!
There are some cracking young-in-service supervisors…….some.
Lance Manley, shaddup you muppet.
That is all.
We then chatted about Conn Iggulden’s “Emperor” novels for 5 minutes and I went home.
Good books …. the Eagle series by scarrow ain’t bad either …
To be honest the last thing I want to do when I get home is switch on TV and start watching Road Wars/Car Wars/Air Wars/COPS/Coppers/ and all the other fly on wall nonsense out there. I particularly hate whatever the cop show is filmed in Slough …18yr old wannabes watch this stuff and think that’s all we do all day, whizzing around in fast cars and promptly want to join up just to do that.
Its been said a few times already but anyone with half a brain would stay clear of any media people because it will nearly always end in tears, like it might do in Notts.
Although reading around the press, its disgraceful the way the ACPO drones are seriously trying to pack peddle. They are the ones who sanctioned this program, clearly hoping for some personal promotional gain and now its gone tits up for them.
I agree with you. When i leave work and go home to slob out on the sofa for a few hours, the last thing i want to watch is something related to work.
I havent watched “Coppers” and never will.
I also agree with what a lot of people here – i dont trust the media and i would never allow a camera crew to film me at work.
But you both follow this blog ?
Yes… they do.
But it’s the SECOND last thing they want to do…….
I’m very surprised at what I saw/heard on the program – including the naivity of some of the officers and how they would be portrayed in heavily edited footage and interviews – including the inspector joking “hanging” himself at the end last night.
The way I see it – I would not be so stupid as to say something in front of a camera that I wouldn’t say in a job interview. You wouldn’t get far if you did a joke hanging with your tie in an interview would you now? Or calling the public “fing useless” – wouldn’t go down well in the Westshire Centre would it?
I don’t criticise any of the officers in their actions – but a lot of it is for behind closed doors and not what is good for our public perception.
At least we didn’t see Traffic Officers posing with their sunglasses on etc.
Very true
The general anti-police ill-informed individual will just become more irritated by these kind of shows I think.
My farce has been filmed in a similar show, I gave the crews a wide birth.
I don’t have any sunglasses, for the record
Not much sunshine in Yorkshire, is there?
I see what you mean, but should it be like that?
A la: robots and not applicants?
42nd
God has 13 fingers.
I remember an input from a police paid Welfare expert on my probationer training positively extolling the virtues of gallows humour. You’d think it was mandatory.
Now we have to pretend that we don’t have it, because we might offend those who don’t have to deal with death.
Go figure.
You don’t see nurses or doctors laughing about it on any fly on the wall documentaries about them. I think creating an ‘illusion’ that every event is treated in the upmost respect is something we should keep – the majority of people are very sheltered and ill informed as to what actually goes on. That’s why we do the job that nobody else does.
Getting back to the van and making comments to your colleagues is one thing.
Gallows humour is a language that is always going to get lost in translation. It’s a language of a different world.
‘You don’t see nurses or doctors laughing about it on any fly on the wall documentaries about them.’
Agreed SpecialC
As a member of the public, this has hugely increased my (very disillusioned) respect for the police. The public want a police force, not diversity outreach officers. Personally I’m reassured by the humour and amazed at the compassion shown to some of these people you have to deal with. I couldn’t do it for sure.
“You don’t see nurses or doctors laughing about it on any fly on the wall documentaries about them”
You don’t see doctors and nurses dealing with immediate-still-unfolding-incidents on the street.
Try the humour you get from the ambo crews -that’ll make you blush!
“I think creating an ‘illusion’ that every event is treated in the upmost respect is something we should keep”
Sort of goes against the point of ‘fly-on-the-wall’ really!!!
‘Try the humour you get from the ambo crews -that’ll make you blush!’
I imagine it would. Their humour repertoire on the topic of body fluids must be particularly extensive. However there have been plenty of fly on the wall documentaries on the ambulance service, but the crews came out of it more favourably than this, who is to know if that was because of their discretion or the production teams, discuss. Is it the difference between ‘fly on the wall’ or ‘warts and all’?
The unit I work on is regularly fiilmed for TV (Despite an overwhelming vote for no cameras). There is a reason you see the same faces all the time. They’re the only ones who will do it. You have to be an idiot to appear on camera. It’s entertainment. TV have no allegiance to the Officers who appear.
Is that the one about Westminster council’s enforcement officers?
After the Rubber Heelers go to work on these officers in this episode maybe the next series will be about the life and death situations faced by ACPO/SMT types in their air conditioned offices on an 8 am till 4pm shift(not weekends obviously)……………should really pull in the viewers.
Next weeks episode….How I single handedly overpowered an obstructive photocopier by Supt Isaac Hunt
There should be a show following single crewed units going to violent situations with no backup. This program is far from realistic – ARVs pushing over drunks – 15 officers most of which are PSU turning up at family rows… how about one Special covering a whole town because everyone is tied up at A&E with prisoners? Thats the reality.
How about only the Specials running one half of the square mile because COLP SC got to run the show for a Sunday early turn?
This felt odd at the time to be honest. Regulars on duty at Snow Hill were only Custody and the TSG (or whatever City calls the TSG, it’s been a while).
Fact that they let them do this was a “nice” way of showing faith in their brothers-in-coat of arms but I was wincing as three of us (SO with me and another guy who weren’t Independent) dealt with one annoying twat who reported a theft in McDonalds but turned out was just lonely and wanted to talk to someone (quote “I went into Micky D’s toilet, defecated, came out and my wallet was gone”).
I think I remember this! I seeme to recall scoffing brekkie at CP4 with a skipper walking in looking like he’d entrusted his crown jewels to a rottweiler!
Oh, have we met?
It’s possible!
Re: TSG equivalent comment – it’s the SOG.
Must have been a loooooooooooong while!
6 years.
I have to say I’ve noticed it’s very rare for these camera crews to be attached to single-crewed patrols.
Funny that…
Not enough protection, obviously. Got to think of their H+S.
Good programme… Eye-opening to those not in the know… Good to see an Inspector care about the job, but being human and ignoring protocol for being in front of the camera (shifty looks sideways, prepared script etc…)
Top 100 hurrah
The idea of a warts & all documentary always sounds great – but it comes at a price in todays image obsessed job. Perceptions arent reality & any film will be edited for impact & brevity. My place had a TV crew following traffic & as a custody sgt I was ordered to accept a prisoner from them with a camera in tow. I refused to have the camera crew & it was only when I quoted the human rights of the other prisoners that they relented & the prisoner came without them. Sad really that I had to quote that to get what I wanted & nothing to do with my own personal thoughts, or PACE etc………….
As a serving officer watching the episode where the drunk was pushed over and then had a coat put over his head, I cringed. What were they thinking? They knew they were on camera and I’m glad to say that I’ve never seen that behaiviour from officers where I work. If you’re going to nick someone, get on with it. There was nothing to be gained from pushing him away before arrest. He wasn’t trying to attack the officers and I couldn’t see that he was posing any threat to them to justify checking him away more than once. That sort of behaiviour on camera does us no favours with the public at all.
Generally the officers featured in that episode appeared stupid and un-able to use any form of tactical communication at all. It was embarrassing and I was ashamed to think my friends and family might think that is how I conduct myself at work.
agreed
I work in a busy city centre. We have a MASSIVE ‘night-time economy’, also known as ‘dealing with violence and drunks’.
It is many a time I have pushed a drunk down the street to remove him from a situation……also known as preventing a breach of the peace or just preventing crime.
Anyone on here that doesn’t do that is probably not front-line, or has the luxury of not working in the cesspit of Britain, that is our towns and cities at the weekends.
As far as the jacket thing goes, I only watched it once but seem to recall the officer asking the drunk not to spit food in his face. I might have done the same, but maybe not in front of the cameras.
I get your point, but it wasn’t midnight on a Saturday with pubs and clubs full. It was one awkward alcoholic. If your going to get hands on, nick him, if not leave him alone.
The copper who put the coat on the drunk also said that the probable reason he was getting covered in bits of sandwich was because the guy had no teeth.
If he was deliberately being spat at then it would have been different.
What’s worse is the guy is an AFO and therefore meant to be extra cool and calm under pressure. A scrawny drunk guy with a cheese sandwich does not really fit that in my opinion.
I’m front line and work in the city centre night time economy (The West End of London to be precise). I’m a response team officer and have been for over 12 years. I’ve never done that and never would. There are ways and means, and that wasn’t it.
You might like to remind yourself of what constitutes a breach of the peace – as I had to: (R v Howell) as well as Article 11 of Human Rights… the right of assembly, or you’re going to get yourself in schtuck mate.
Well said Ploddy. I was embarrassed for all the decent officers I know are out there. The behaviour of their colleagues on camera especially the shoving incident and throwing the coat over the guys head was shameful. I think they just show off in front of the camera and the very fact they do shows they are so stupid! Hopefully in future episodes they will be better behaved.
Re last nights ‘Coppers’ – I think the point the Inspector was trying to get accross at the end of the program (by holding his tie above his head) was the inability of the police to solve deep-rooted societal probems. Specifically he was referring the drunks and crack heads and noting that, whilst these people are a drain on police resources, the police are not the organisation that will be able to cure their addiction problems.
I thought he made the point rather well and conveyed what most officers feel about the weary and pointless nature much of what they are asked to deal with. The waring neighbours behaving like 5 year olds were a case in point.
I’m am not surprised Notts ACPO are so removed from reality that they are shocked by what their officers think and the utter crap they have to deal with on a daily basis. There is probably more mutual understanding between your reasonable and average MOP and police officers than with our so called leaders. I’m sure many MOPs are releaved to hear that many ‘coppers’ think along similar lines to themselves. MOPs can see through coporate bullsh*t, it’s a shame that ACPO cannot.
If an MOP is a member of the public, agreed.
MOP = member of the public. I like your doggy.
The show looks great! Just watching now and the intro had a clip of a drunk smashing his head against the van door.
Its odd, because I like a good booze up myself yet have never felt the need to smash my own face in…
Each to their own..
Seems like the ACC found he had a voice and used it to voice an honest opinion.
Seems like someone pulled the cord on the back of the ACPO DCC doll and it trotted out all the pre-recorded newspeak needed to protect his position. Spineless peon. Wonder if he has Eagle Eyes too?
I though the inspector hanging himself with his necktie was pure comedy gold – he was merely expressing the exasperation with dealing with the same idiotic rubbish over and over again. Seems like a sound bloke.
Its about time ACPO got the documentary treatment isn’t it?
It would be good to see them behind closed doors in a place where no criminal need be confronted……
There was something – a while back – I remember seeing a Twonk called Pilkington (UDH) being interviewed for an ACC Job with D and C – he came over a a complete tool – so he got the Job!
Day 24 in the Ivory tower…. the ACC has a problem with his photocopier so he calls Marion (his personal management assistant). while she fixes it they discuss a program which was on TV the night before. The ACC had not seen it but thought it sounded bad….so he turned to the camera and stated “that sounds awful”…. he then phones PSD and demands an investigation……..
Next week on TOSSERS the Chief has a papercut…
“the inspector hanging himself with his tie was pure comedy gold – he was merely expressing the exasperation with dealing with the same idiotic rubbish over and over again”
Agreed. Maybe he is Inspector Gadget??
(Except Gadget wears a black neo-nazi patrol shirt)
Black patrol shirts.. how gucci, I wish we in response had something like that. Our TSG/crime teams wear a green poloshirt and greenish combats, really good quality ones too. Instead we on the poop deck wear shirts and ties. Because thats the best uniform to wear to do our job. Of course, we could not police if we did not wear a tie, what a silly notion!
I was in in the era of white, non-whicking (sp?) cotton shirts, stay pressed trousies and that lovely breathable, summer-friendly fabric Kevlar.
Remember well the sopping backs visible during refs while the Stabbies hummed quietly near the canteen radiator as they dried out.
Both my previous farces are now on black gear, which is apparently less sweaty and also looks well ‘ard. Saw a photo of my old guv in his blacks. Would have scared any Stella sloshing Chav into sobriety just by glaring at them.
A plus to the black tops are that they need no ironing!
Non-iron tops and sticked crease combats are the only reason I joined.
Mum won’t do my ironing anymore
Sticked = stiched
stitched…only here to help.
“Both my previous farces are now on black gear”
I was working with 4 COLP bods last week and they had white shirts and ties?
I did love their black handcuffs though, plus the body armour with stick, squirt and cuff pouches attached – mega practical
My intel is clearly wrong. Love the way in COLP an Acting Inspector gets Crown over Chevrons (or Chevrons over Crown) leading to much confusion amongst Specials who know they are facing a senior rank but have no idea which one.
My old force have all the kit fixes to the body armour too, and it’s extremely practical. The down side is that they have to wear yellow hi-viz things with it all attached on to it because the SMT want them to look stupid.
But the have lovely black (or is it white?) tee shirt things instead of half a lounge suit like we have in Metrocity. BHH even said a few weeks back that the London public didn’t want us in practical clothing. How come the rest of the country don’t care? Pfft.
Hard to see how he made Inspector if he hasn’t the good sense NOT to do that on TV.
OK,OK I haven’t seen the footage, and I’m not going to watch it either. I remember badly enough how the episodes of the Heathrow series with cops went.
Only an idiot would let the media film him at work. It sounds as though the camera crew managed to find a whole bunch of them!
Bill.
You’ll never know where those few seconds were edited from and if they were taken out of context.
Gadget thinks that Insp. is a hero. Gone down in my estimation and can no longer take him seriously.
Well you need to HTFU.
Just sayin’.
“Hard to see how he made Inspector if he hasn’t the good sense NOT to do that on TV” ……………
He probably didn’t do it in the middle of his 2 promotion boards giving him a better chance of sucess I imagine …….
personally I didn’t have a problem with his actions and gave them not a seconds thought … if people are really bothered by 2 seconds of TV showing some uniformed Inspector mimicking stringing himself up as he’s frustrated by the endless petty shite we have to endure due to pandering to pathetic squabbles between Wayne and Kylie they are probably closet social workers ….. and most probably none frontline staff …
I concur with the opinion on here that appearing in any documentary about the job voluntarily is not advisable. In fact I think that it is complete and utter madness and a one way ticket to a career ending decision. The sensationalist media beast are not our friend, and never will be. Make a mistake on camera and you’ve just handed psd evidence to come crawling and sniffing around you like that damn snake out of jungle book. As those fingered by the DCC will soon find out. Yet more negativity on my part, but when you see the varying interpretations of this blog of what occurred last night, from those on the job, then how’s it going to look to Joe the Mop? Only one outcome there!
This will appear twice I’m afraid, bloody phone!
I cringed at the pushing incident. Either arrest the man or not. The pushing was less than professional. In other parts, there were some who showed themselves in a poor light. If you want respect then act in a firm and decisive manner without acting like buffoons. You will never obtain respect if you operate at the level of the people you are trying to deal with.
Gallows humour is not for public consumption, it is the escape one requires in order to be able to deal with incidents which would leave most members of the public in a state of collapse.
I feel Notts senior officers showed lack of foresight if they thought they could benefit from allowing the programme to be produced; it was in fact bound to blow up in their faces.
In anticipation of those who might enquire, yes I am a member of the public
but I served in the green as a regular from seventeen and did twenty seven years in The Met , eleven as a PC and the rest as a PS. And for what it’s worth,
you (police) were bady let down by some of your colleagues who were less than mature, especially when they must have been aware that their comments and actions were being filmed.
All I could think in the watching of that clip was “FKIN GET ON WITH IT!!!!”
Either nick the tw@t or walk away, stop dancing with him and acting like a fking schoolkid and get the cuffs on him.
Ive seen more of this kind of thing, especially as nicking people is becoming more and more weary
That officer was very lucky that the drunk didn’t fracture his skull when he hit the pavement, otherwise he would almost certainly have been facing a charge of manslaughter.
On the face of it there was no need at all for what he did, a simple arrest would have been OK, not the sort of officer whom the comments generally here portray.
Agreed. They were firearms officers.
Ahem.
There’s nothing wrong with firearms officers Inspector…
Firearms officers dont tend to like making arrests, though do they?
Hells teeth! Making arrests?! Not in my remit mucker!!
Did a statement last week tho. Remember when you were at school and the first day back after summer hols? Writing for the first time in 6 weeks? It was like that. Pheeeeeeew.
Hair gel?! No hair to gel
Extra tight t shirts on order so I can flex them guns
Lovely banter fellas!
Got hand cramp after a few sentences of writing.
Dammit just know it will affect my aim!
Hey baldy Sorry… Follice’ly challenged …….suppose few xxl shirts on order then?
Give those doughnuts up man!
No need to get personal.
LmAO
Have dodgy IC7 to counteract here.
Red in beard does not an IC7 make.
Dammit!
Titian methinks.
Been a shit week…… hey and it’s only Jan!
Poor Notts guys.
Reacher – I hopeI’m not alone in saying this, but, what?
Just joking about GAPPA. H
Long standing joke on this blog.
Google it!
Googled.checked,
Yougottabewmp
Nothing that some hair gel and a good pair of sunnies can’t fix!
Think the Guv is AFO if I remember correctly.
Dammit missed the show and all the nonsense that is going with it! Strange how most MOP feedback has been unanimously positive about Coppers so far and the humour has been understood and enjoyed.
Arrests? you will be expecting statement-taking next!
Apart from the facial hair.
Those are balaclavas not facial hair!
Where is that specsavers link?
It’s been an eye opener for him…. WTF??? There’s an indictment of senior officers if ever there was one. Talk about losing track of real day to day policing.
Just what I thought.
Probably thinks the local slag run about saying “Lummey Guv’nor it’s a fair cop” stealing watches and silk handkerchiefs from the waistcoat pockets of kindly old gentlemen.
Watch Tim-Piggot Smith in “The Chief” (seasons 1 & 2, DON’T watch it when Bodie (or was it Doyle) takes over in season 3).
An example of what ACPO should be like (lays down next to a police sniper and whispers angrily “take the shot or I’ll take your gun and take it for you!”)
Made more entertaining by the fact that it’s Trigger from Only Fools and… who the sniper is aiming at.
*2nd attempt. May appear twice.
Watch “The Chief” (seasons 1 & 2, DON’T watch it when Bodie…or was it Doyle?…takes over in season 3).
An example of what ACPO should be like (Chief Constable lays down next to a police sniper and whispers angrily “take the shot or I’ll take your gun and take it for you!”)
Made more entertaining by the fact that it’s Trigger from Only Fools and… who the sniper is aiming at.
*3rd attempt. May appear again. Apparently direct replies to Gadget’s comments automatically get diverted to Spamville for screening.
Now Mance………………… there’s changing your username to dodge the spam filter…… and there’s just plain lying……
I haven’t watched it. But what I would say, is that how Chris Eyre has become a shiny hatted type clearly having absolutely no idea what being a police officer is actually like, is beyond me.
I have dealt with enough dead bodies and other thoroughly unpleasant incidents to know that a large number of people use humour to diffuse the tension of the situation – obviously not in front of the family, or other members of public – the fact that Notts allowed this to be filmed apparently oblivious to what their own PCs and DCs are likely to say in certain situations shows a shocking niaveity (I can never spell that word) on behalf of their Senior Management.
Which would lead you to believe that they have no actual understanding of what goes on in the course of street level policing.
And we are all very surprised about that.
Aren’t we?
Uh, no. We ain’t!
I wanted to say all that but this phones a PITA for long spiels.
Long spiels and grammatical-free, sensible posts.
Piddly phones.
I feel you man!
I can’t believe the negativity towards the media on here!!! It’s not nearly negative enough. Time and time again they’ve served as judge, jury and so on. Anyone who willingly puts themself on camera really needs their head examined. Throughout my service I’ve only ever been asked twice, both times flatly refused. As for the Inspector who may-or-may-not be Gadget, good on you Sir. Comedy genius. I watched the programme with a friend who I can only describe as a female Frankie Boyle. Her suggestion of a lead lined “Bullshit Boxing Glove” for use by bobbies on persistent, trivial nuisance callers has real merit. I doubt the set of neighbours on the programme would call again in a “grow up, sort it or we use this” ultimatum.
Some of brit cops was filmed where I work. I flat out refused to have the camera crew in my car. Everybody I know who ended up on it looks like a right twit, whether or not they are actually like that.
I think my right elbow made it on to an episode of Road Wars some years back. It was pixellated at my request…
I’ve watched all three episodes now… the first was OK… the second was “controversial” due to the pushing incident and the 14 year old dragged down to the ground (she was drunk… but anyway)…. not condemning any officer as I wasn’t there but as I sat and watched I thought to myself “I really hope they have done plenty writing!!!”.
This whole issue has already been debated to death…. some further bedtime reading here… http://www.policespecials.com/forum/index.php?/topic/125853-coppers-series-2-tonight/
Oh and should have added I thought that last nights episode was better and certainly more like the day to day stuff we deal with.
All things considered I think it is a welcome addition to the myriad of fly on the wall police docu’s.
I have just watched this. What’s the “pushing” incident that everyone is referring to?
Only thing that looks like this is when the “sheriff” of Worksop tells that annoying twat off for giving the camera the finger.
As for the Inspector. What in the name of octogenarian fornication was wrong with THAT? He’s got a sense of humour and is illustrating a point. Good on the bloke I say.
Oh, and this isn’t Gadget as apparently Gadget is a female Chief Super working in Lancashire.
just read the comment above mine. Didn’t realise that I have apparently skipped an episode.
J M 10
I must strongly protest on behalf of my fellow octogenerians over your comment above.
As the only eighty year old commenting on this blog ( I am aren’t I?) I do not wish our sexual proclivities to be bandied about on this forum. You may well be doing unspeakable thinks with an old spear, we are more advanced and use electronic devices which are far more civilised and user friendly.
We also object to you airing your sweaty linen in public, you sir are not a gentleman!
SP
I just choked on my tea. Thanks for making me giggle.
I would ask about the electronic devices Scarlet but your answer would probably keep me up at night….. worrying!
Can I ask the difference between dirty and sweaty?
Really not sure what Lance meant with his comment.
Good old girl … or indeed .. boy !
This ” sheriff”- where was his Stab vest? Is it not mandatory in Notts? Even if it isn’t, I wouldn’t go out without one in an area like that
You would have thought forces may have spoken to each other, West Yorks officer after the now famouse “YOUR NOT TELLING ME TO SUCK YOUR CO*K FELLA” was stuck on and sergeants likewise with the CC fuming for months.
Its bad enough every feral urchin has a mobilephone on which they record every police interactions, which we then in turn record on a headcam. I often feel i am 13 again and taking a picture in the mirror!
On a less serious note; there’s technology begging to be used in your average porno!
ha ha, not with my mrs theres not!
Not actually seen the show, I take it they had the good taste not to use “Bad boys, bad boys, whatcha gonna doooo” as the theme tune?
As for those having a whinge at “Gallows humour”, the phrase “Harden the f*ck up” springs to mind. It’s a hard working, male oriented (Contrary to popular belief) workplace and from the bits mentioned here, was pretty tame stuff.
True story, back in the 60s my dad was a printer. One of his workmates came home to find his wife dead with her head in the gas oven. My dad says to him “Sorry to hear about the wife John? the bloke answers “Yeah thanks mate, I wouldn’t care but she killed t’bloody dog an all!!”.
The DCC is clearly a complete tool. I seem to recall my farce saying that they had made an agreement with a tv company whereby individuals lost the right to have themselves obscured or removed.
I was also called a wanker by a director some years ago for refusing to accompany a PCSO walking around for some pointless local tv show.
In other news, my farce is banging on about February being LGBT History month, so thats ok then.
I watched the episodes and the ‘gallows humour’ is as it is nothing wrong as it does reflect reality – other walks of life are little differant. The only thing I watched that made me cringe and immediately link to Tomlinson was the pushing over of the drunk. I am sure I was not alone in that. It was not at all professional. Sorry but it was seriously out of order.
Out of order it may have been but the police are not Terminators and I 100% hope that Tomlinson’s pusher gets acquitted when he finally gets to trial.
Assuming use of force is “dirty” and that the police are robots who can switch aggression on and off like machines leads to the embarrassing displays we got in the riots last August (i.e. “don’t intervene, we’re on camera and it’ll look bad”).
Pushing someone over who is being a drunken imbecile is usually not the main intention of shoving them in the first place. It’s to get them to fornicate off.
Thought last weeks programme and last nights programme highlighted the dregs we have to deal with! The incidents last week showed how hard it is to deal with members of the public at times! Thought the shove was a cheap shot by an armed copper who let the drunk wind him up!! What makes things worse the scum shown in all the shows are helped craddle to the jail get everything the want and have just had a 5% pay rise without working! There us no consequence to their actions the courts believe their sob stories presented by their free legal advice ! They don’t want to work the state and ultimately the tax payees will provide for their every whim and desire! They get to hate the police because we are the organisation from the state that doesn’t pander to them and provide them with free stuff. Prison is almost like home except the booze and drugs are harder to get and the don’t lay in as much!
What he said!
Senior management have little grasp of real practical policing today as that doesn’t really get you promotion! Staying in the office going to multiple agency meetings and reading all the crap reports slagging police off and being able to demonstrate diversity does! We once had a borough commander who had made two arrests in their whole career! Most of it on the higher development scheme had been as a batman or various back offices that ticked the right boxes!
I await the episode involving the police officers equipped with firearms and prey to god they don’t exhibit the same crass, vulgar and bullying behaviour of those officers in the first two episodes.
The way that homeless man was repeatedly shoved in the second episode and the arrogant and insensitive behaviour of some of the CID officers in the first have done nothing to improve public confidence in the police and will put paid to the notion of regularly arming all police officers with tasers or otherwise, unless they can considerably demonstrate respect for the general public.
ZZZZZZZzzzzzzzz Back to your bubble
Shock horror, the police are human! Middle class sensibilities will be offended at the vulgar working class cops!
Not a class thing, cretin. The meejah show society as it is, that the public can be venal drunks with no horizon beyond the next pay day or that plod are cowardly, corrupt, mendacious racist vermin.
‘Where there is patience and humility, there is neither anger nor vexation.’ You damage any cause you may have against the police with your anger, Ciaran. Attend anger management classes and if they don’t work, shut-the-fuck-up classes will hopefully do the trick…
Seriously mate, he follows me round, just ignore….
Fair point.
what does mendacious mean?
I wish he wouldnt use such complicated words, far too much for a lowly ‘fascist arm of the state’
It means ‘I have a thesaurus to hand and too much time to waste’
Lying mother…as in weapons grade fibber….. I think!
Who the fck can tell?
Again disciplined for erm humour!
Dammit.
Have you tried pushing him over, Dibbs?
Gets coat…
lol
I wonder why we never see documentaries about the daily lives of Victor Stirling and Ciaran Rehill:
“Watch the exciting action as another internet post is sent. Follow the poring through dictionaries to make a pedantic point. Marvel at the risks they take from their comfy armchairs. Feel the adrenaline as they confront angry people anonymously on a computer. Laugh as they risk their lives making another cup of tea.”
Yep. I’d tune in.
Not.
Revel in the passion as they open the La Senza catalogue and gaze lovingly at the recently warmed tub of Swarfega
Good God that gave me laugh!
Buzz. Me thinks you are too kind. Swarfega gives the impression that those get their hands dirty. I was thinking more along the lines of two chicken fillets in a jam jar with some warm water. After burning off some calories, they mat be hungry!
A swimming arm-band full of warm water and half a jar of Nivea?
Careful notts cops, don’t post.
ACC DCC CC! It like police Top Trumps……Now there is a game we could play.
Any suggestions on how ones vital stats could top the others?
Amount of time on the beat.
Amount of arrests made when past the rank of Inspector.
Has served in a “badass” unit such as TSG, Dogs or Firearms (the latter is 100)
Amount of time has used “community” or other crap in press communications.
Amount of times let OST ticket lapse after rank of Inspector.
“Has served in a “badass” unit such as TSG, Dogs or Firearms (the latter is 100)”
Duuuuude seriously, lube up and grab your ankles if you love them that much.
You have read my book? In the English police a “badass” unit is certainly not Neighbourhood, Volume Crime Team, Diversity & Community or PSD.
I dont think there are any ‘badass’ or ‘Gucci’ units left anymore. PCism and extreme accountability has ruined it for all.
I lent your book to a CID mate of mine before I’d read it and the fecker won’t give it back.
Just as a matter of interest. Are you COLP? Or Met formerly COLP?
Drop me a line via my blog and reveal all.
According to a very senior Special in City, STAB PROOF SCARECROWS was largely enjoyed, mainly as I had portrayed them 90% positively.
The Other Force were annoyed up to the level of ACC though. Still love to get a copy of his letter to those they thought they’d matched to my pseudonyms that basically said “pay no attention to the nasty man”.
I’ll get in touch somehow- or email Dan?
Yeah, go through Dan. Probably easiest way. And best way to inadvertently get PSD sliding down ropes, wearing balaclavas to “have a word in your shell like”.
Just as a matter of interest. Are you COLP? Or Met formerly COLP?
Drop me a line via my blog and reveal all.
According to a very senior Special in City, SPS was largely enjoyed, mainly as I had portrayed them 90% positively.
The Other Force were annoyed up to the level of ACC though. Still love to get a copy of his letter to those they thought they’d matched to my pseudonyms that basically said “pay no attention to the nasty man”.
* 2nd attempt. May appear again. I had the insurmountable temerity to mention the name of the book in attempt 1.
First episode – Arrogant
Second episode – Thuggish
Third episode – Professional
DCC – deluded
ACC – see above
Im no NPT lover as my background is CID and response but they put the others to shame
NPT differs a lot around the country. For us, they tend to be a halfway house between PPU, RPT, VCU and somewhere for CID to get footwork and local intel from.
Really? I thought the “I can talk to anyone and give mutual respect” guy was embarrassing (as did two non-job watching with me) although I could see a use for him if I was posted on the same team as him. The CID I thought came across ok, as did the SNT (NPT/whatever) as they are slow time and can think when dealing “I have a camera watching me… let’s look good”.
Response is messy, and never looks good edited. I admit I think the 14 yr old girl going over was an accident watching the PC pulling her and realising she’s a big, drunk unit. The pushing the alcoholic over and shoving the coat on his head I thought was showing off for the camera… The other officer acted well throughout it all.
Can’t wait for the “Rookie” episode next week though.
When they spent a couple months with my lot filming, I flatly refused to take a cameraman out, I said they were a liability and attracted trouble.
Which they did.
All I will say is I,m so glad I wasnt the one going ” Nee Naw Nee Naw”……..
Or Booyakasha!… surprised they didn’t have a few “Whoop Whoop, Dats the Sound of Da Police” (KRS-One)
Those two really wind me up
Tried to post earlier from my phone,must be lost in cyberspace. To summarise:
I concur with the general view here, not a great idea to take part in any national media venture. They are not our friends and will have a feeding frenzy if you make a mistake in front of the camera. It’s a one way ticket to the disciplinary court, with evidence handed on a plate to those that would see your career ended at a stroke of a pen. I can almost hear PSD crawling and slithering around this one like that god damned snake out of Jungle Book, as our colleagues from last nights show will soon find out. Lets see if the ACC will stand by them, we already know the DCC won’t.
What was he thinking!!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-16708502
Probably of getting his end away !
just watched coppers on you tube (theres a 1 st 4 me),apart from the drunken buffoon who I would have locked up earlier,I can’t see a problem with anything the officers did.
Maybe I am being too heavily influenced by the ITV 4 repeats of the SWEENEY??.
Top post as normal gaffer,hat off to you.
I am pretty sure I’d never utter the phrase, “there’s a new sheriff in town” to anybody tbh! ;P
I used to work for a company that was always appearing on “Watchdog”. After a run of really lousy pieces for ourselves and two other companies, the PR people met with the BBC to put our side. Their response was that they had loads more and all they were interested in was filling airtime.
We also had a documentary made about us, they were looking for “characters”, they then managed to make them all look stupid. This was mostly because the programme makers had moved people out of there usual sphere and surprise, surprise they were useless in a role they knew little about.
Don’t do it!
Anyone watching Cowboy Builders on Channel 5. I went to school with this slug. The sting operation appears to be outside Warwickshire Justice Centre. Believe me, it’s less impressive in real life.
Police officers on pay freeze….working 2 days and 4 nights on a rota and often on their own. The following list of job vacancies on the Notts Police web site just speaks volumes for where the likes of Dcc Eyre thinks the important issues lay.
Telephone Interviewer
Infrastructure Services Manager (ICT Directorate)
Service Desk – Team Manager
Management Information Officer
Geographical Information Systems (GIS) Assistant
Operations Engineer – ICT Directorate
Business Analyst/Developer – ICT Directorate
Business Marketing Advisor
Business Relationship and Project Manager
The corporate departments are obviously not subject to cuts. How can this idiot complain about the reality of what happens on the streets when his officers struggle with understaffing and poor command..Are the command in Notts so naive as they cannot remember Thames Vally and the rape interviews and are they really so far removed from reality that they dont know what really goes on in REAL LIFE !!! I think the recent staff opinion surveys speak volumes…IF only the public really knew what a farce these so called leaders are.
Chris Eyre didn’t sound too pleased about the second episode on Radio Nottingham, nor in this article in the local paper. http://www.thisisnottingham.co.uk/Police-authority-alarmed-Coppers/story-14995040-detail/story.html
I was pretty angry after watching the second show. I saw the first one afterwards and thought it was tame by comparison. I watched yesterday and was quite impressed with some of what I saw. There was one guy in particular working with an autistic kid and his mum, and trying to intercede between neighbours, who I thought was doing a brilliant job based on the footage.
I thought he was show boating to be honest. All his big talk about how he was head hunted for NPT, and of how he solves all these problems……
Maybe they could have shown some problems he’s “solved” in the past because, in my experience, if people don’t move (or be moved) away from a situation, the police never solve it.
I thought that too. Head-hunted for Neighbourhood…… yeah right.
The pushing thing looked very ugly. However, if he had nicked the bloke in metrocity he would have been down A+E for the next 4 hour. imagine it is much the same elsewhere, at A+E and constant watch. As per form the bloke was a complete pain in the arse in custody. In the bad old days, quick book and out. Now 3 hrs minimum off with this shit. With fewer numbers and people up against it to answer emergency calls cops will do more and more cutting of corners and putting themselves on offer. I’m quite sure that the Notts management would be screaming blue murder if every street drinker who was being a pain in the arse was brought in. On another note, I would never go out with a camera.
Sorry to take your post off topic, but your mention of A & E reminded me of another programme broadcast last night on More4 called “Confessions of a Nurse”, not an adult movie, but an insight in the lives of frontline care professionals. Did anyone see it?
Compare and contrast the nurse on £21k (I think) who, after transferring to a different ward, dealt with extremely difficult patients with a high level of professionalism and care, to the surly police officer who pushed the troubled homeless man to the ground because he was annoyed.
What really struck me was the nurse who after promotion was responsible for running the hospital and still put in extra effort with the patients in her care for £35k, which is approximately the same as a Sgt and considerably less than Inspector.
In the present financial climate, the NHS and other frontline services are facing cuts to staffing and pensions (which are knowhere near as generous as the police service receive), and you have to ask the question. Although policing is a difficult job, do you really believe that, considering what the rest of the country is facing financially, that the police service should be cocooned from the cuts?
All the comments on the drunk man being pushed.
Sometimes things get nasty and we have to deal with nasty people.
We get sworn at, spat at and assaulted. Sometimes we have to get hands on and use force.
The thing is… we have to act professionally in the public eye. I never swear at ANYONE in public. No matter what they are saying to me. I would never be dragged down to their level. Keep calm at all times.
I watched the small clip of the man being pushed and i do think the officer was wrong in his attitude. Ok.. pushing him away to tell him to move on. But then cuffing him and throwing the coat over his head…. WRONG! What was the point? To humiliate him?
The way i look at any job i go to…. how would i want this person to be treated if he was my father, my mother, my brother… etc. And i know people will answer “my family would never act like that”… but we dont know how that homeless man got into that position. My guess is that his alcoholism took over.
We still have to have compassion and not judge.
The clip with the drunk man being pushed was edited, so i dont know what was happening beforehand. But it did seem to me that a bit more verbal communication could have helped, rather than pushing him and throwing his coat over his head.
This is why i never watch “cop” shows.
And if the ACC, or whoever it was, has a problem with his frontline officers then i suggest he looks towards himself. He is supposed to be the senior officer… the “leader”. I would hope that he now spends time going out with his response officers and experience it all first hand. He is responsible for the training of his staff. If he has a problem, then he needs to solve it.
“The way i look at any job i go to…. how would i want this person to be treated if he was my father, my mother, my brother… etc.”
To be fair, if any of my kith and kin were acting like that then bolleaux to ‘em and theyll gets what coming.
The copper shouldve just nicked him for D&D though, instead of mincing about, especially with that tache
but we dont know how that homeless man got into that position. My guess is that his alcoholism took over.”
Yes if in doubt, just guess.
Well, trying to be compassionate and understanding towards another human being… is much better than throwing a coat over their heads and acting like a big, fat bully isnt it?
What we also don’t know is if the drunk was a habitual spitter. Maybe the cop on the spot was best placed to make that decision. Don’t you? Best not to criticise from our chairs.
I didn’t think the CID officers from the 1st episode were arrogant at all. Cynical and Tired of dealing with idiots who Play the system and regularly evade justice maybe.
What’s with all these custody areas allowing prisoners to stand around on their own without being held? We’d get our ass kicked by our duty officers if we did that.
Cutbacks – coming to a custody near you soon !!
Custody is an area they want to completely civilianise.
Part of me says they’re welcome to it. But imagine how obstructive civvies making those decisions would be towards officers.
On the nail.
Then watch it all go mammaries up. On TV.
Metrocity is civilianising custody officers using DDO inputters – which makes financial sense because they can cut down on 30+ skippers and replace them with cheap DDOs. However, they are not hiring new police staff so PC’s are being pulled off team to cover the gaps.
The end results are more Response officers languishing in the cells wasting most of their skills and training, while DDO’s (who were meant to free expensive officers up for the front line) sit on their derrières and pretend to be sergeants.
The problem comes when our DOs have to get hands on with a stroppy PIC (Not allowed to unless for urgent self defence). They have to call the cavalry, which is me.
Mate, have you not had the recent sulk-fest of senior ranks coming in and getting the hump seeing skippers booking in prisoners at emptry workstations when there’s a big queue?
Myself and a few other chums have had this at our respective nicks recently where skippers are ONLY allowed to authorise detention and MUST NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES assist in the inputting of data or booking in of detainees.
the result is the worlds longest queue to get in the nick and some rather sober drink drive prisoners getting booked in (I sh1t thee not) 3 hours after arrest.
joy
We haven’t got to that point yet – generally have 3 or 4 skippers and one DDO inputter – leading to the farcical situation where one skipper is sitting behind a DDO effectively doing nothing, because there are only 4 workstations at the desk (I suggested the DDO do some DDO’ing but was told “if they are shown inputter on CARMS than they aren’t allowed to”.
Custody suits seem to be being closed left right and centre – the justification being that they are often not run at full capacity. We’ll leave aside the fact that running them at full capacity is far more dangerous than at half; having spare capacity means that we aren’t sending units all over the Met on a Friday night – or as you point out, letting drink drivers get away with it.
Senior ranks really are frakkin’ clueless. If they wanted a job that was all about the bottom line they should’ve gone into banking and screwed that up instead. At least the police are supposed to pretend to care about the country…!
Civianise! then watch them get head butted and start bleating. Next you’ll want HATO’s to breath test and PCSO Dog Handlers.
PCSO dog handlers? Would they be allowed to use their own dog, a pitbull called “Mutley”? I’d also need a pair of those “Stitched crease combats” in black natch, a baseball cap that I can wear backwards whilst “Shootin the breeze” (No no I didn’t mean “shootin”) I mean er…”scoping the er…” (No no I didn’t mean scop….) I mean whilst I’m er…”reconnoitering the community?” Yes that’s what I meant “Community”.
They’d also need to be equipped with a pair of wrap round shades, one of those hands free earpieces with mic, oh yes and “Sir, sir (waves hand in the air) can we grow a moustache sir?”.
I personally can’t wait until they start DCSOs, where people can just walk in off the street and be a “Community support detective”. In fact I’m using this as a formal request to be placed on the shortlist as someone somewhere is bound to be considering implementing it….
I know a few PCs and Skippers who’ve handled Dog-PCSOs, same thing?
I’m not up on current ACPO guidelines, but rumour has it the term “Dog PCSOs” could be construed as being a bit sexist, and there was talk of they being now referred to as MILF PCSOs.
This was sadly short lived, and put down to a break down in communication, once it became apparent that applications to join the newly formed “Milf handling division” skyrocketed….
Wasn’t there a MILF PCSO on Coppers the other night.
Handled or fingered
Budvar. Check this out.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150207576845824&set=a.325238755823.161370.289541280823&type=3&theater
Oh for the love of God, don’t get me started on Northern Constabulary or the Shetney (Shetland/Orkney) Judiciary…
1. I think the law-abiding public will be heartened to see that rank-and-file plods are doing their best to deal with the scrotes and underclass.
2. PCSO MILF is most certainly a MILF.
Personally thought she was average at best!
Because I’m nearly 50, I thought she was a stunner……
I bet your knuckles drag on the ground too.
You know what, I have said this on here before.
I once pushed somebody, once! And I didn’t lock him up! Put this info on an incident log. A D. Inspector read it, and I was hauled over the coals! I was basically told, lay hands on anyone and they get locked up!
Probs. be a bit different now that they have closed 2 custody areas!
I believe the first of these ‘fly on the wall’ films was Police Harrow Road, presented by; I think Esther Rantzen. About 1973, it was possibly the last of the genre not to have an agenda which was likely to focus on the less than perfect performance.
It showed an era when policing was simpler, albeit DR in the 70s was a violent and dangerous place. We had no ppe other than a wooden stick, no handcuffs, and radios which were more often a hindrance than a help.
Proper tunics, shirts without collars so they had to be attached with studs, and raincoats which seemed to weigh tons.
Equipment today may not be perfect but it is a lot better than it was then. The Federation has had to fight tooth and nail over the years to get every single item of kit over certain ACPO officers objections.
We did however have an ACPO officer (Willy Hunter) who visited every police station on his Division every morning before 8am and read every charge sheet, so he could be in a position to know who made themselves busy.
He always praised PCs personally, and delegated bollockings to sub Divisional Superintendents.
If anybody could find that old film it would make an interesting comparison.
I long for the smell of a wet Gannex, the Pye set aerial that sprang up as you switched to transit was a real eye opener. All that for £40 pond less per month than I earned in the mob. Those were the days. Then Roger Graef came along and spoiled it. Bloody media.
I long for the smell of a heavy wet Gannex, The way the Pye set aerial sprang up on transmit was a real eye opener… literally. When the late Chief Inspector (RIP) would end the morning briefing,(Such as it was) with ” And don’t put the f******g press through to me, tell them to f**k off”. Those were the days, and I earned £40 less per month than I got in the mob, even with lodging allowance. Then Roger Graef came along and the media ghouls followed in droves.
Don’t get involved with them, follow the words of the late Chief Inspector.
Indeed Roger Graef and his fly on the wall of TVP and the infamous interview with the nutty woman. Ghouls indeed and yet some Old Bill never learn and that’s why I don’t watch things like ‘Coppers’ because there’s always one or two numptys (or more in the case of this ‘Coppers’) who cannot process what they are doing or saying AND especially these days FFS. Al behave like Ricky Gervais’s David Brent playing up to the camera. That said this evening’s ‘Death Row Dogs’ was great viewing, the officers were very professional and spoke well, clearly knew their stuff PLUS they had a great supporting cast from the Chavistocracy and ming-mong central. I kept wishing some of these DNA wasters were led off for a fatal injection – Ye Gods! The future of GB and the HoL’s wants to protect these fuckers benefits! The end piece was unbelievable -self-pitying scum unable to accept responsibility for what had happened to a young child.
Weren’t Chief Inspectors up to the end of the 1980′s fucking great? Now look at the spineless ACPO wannabees. DCI’s were feared beasts too – now they’re ‘crime managers’, desk flying johnnies!
Anyway, I could go on but I won’t – night night!
The old pye radios? Crying out loud, that’s going back some. I had one of those as a kid back in the 70s, pale blue it was. It had no gubbins inside, basically just a case with the spring loaded aerial that fired out when you pressed the orange transmit button. Get caught with one of those today, and you’d be before the beak so fast on a charge of carrying and offensive weapon….
Esther went off us after her Fulham Market arrest didn’t she.
DR was indeed a tough old place then. You’d talk to members of the public and see them looking at your epaulettes. Eventually I asked one why. Turned out he wanted to know if I was B or D division.
” Rough sorts, them ‘Arrow Road lads” he said.
Always glad to hear Delta Three’s two-tones when I put up urgent assistance in All saints Road, though
Saved my arse many a time did the DR lads.
Bill.
Could have been me driving D3, I loved that old Triumph PI.
I can still hear that engine howl on ‘kickdown’. Did you ever hurt your thumb on the steering wheel aluminium spokes 72?
Terry Barnicoat did on Bravo Three.
Bill
That I didn’t but I did often use to strap on B3 if Terry or Tim Richardson were off, they reciprocated on D3
72 joiner, can you clarify this `strap on B3` thing please? I never got issued with one of these.
Comment on the latest episode.
Easily the greatest TV comedy moment of all time
Disgruntled neighbour: I’ve got the chewing gum in the freezer
PC: Is it spearmint
Disgruntled neighbour: Yes its spearmint
Give that bloody PC a medal. Bloody brilliant. Couldn’t stop laughing!!!
first post so didn’t show so…..
The latest episode has the single greatest TV comedy moment of all time
Disgruntled neighbour: ive put the chewing gum in the freezer
PC: Is it spearmint?
Disgruntled neighbour: Yes
Give that PC a medal. Bloody brilliant. Could’t stop laughing!!
“Real Policing”?? Why don’t they have a program following an arrest through to charge, all in real time of course!!! Covering booking in, fingerprints, DNA, photo, all using language line. Seizing of clothing and the laborious method of packaging we must use. The endless notes we then have to write and the minute detail we must include. The justification we need to show for every decision we make ( I raised my voice to Mr Fister due to…..yadda, yadda, yadda ) Then duplicate into a crime report and duplicate again onto a Merlin (child involved, present or a member of the “family”). Then all the MG forms for the file including the MG5 which again is a duplication of what happened….and on and on. I’ve not even mentioned the interview and what happens if the susp goes not guilty. The amount of time and money involved in dealing with a “Simple” arrest is stupefying!!!! All done of course to such a perfect standard after a busy week of shifts and at the end of crappy night shift, without a break for food, where you then stay at work and spend 4hours + just writing/packaging/typing. The standard of which will be scrutinised to death by some 8-4 Mon -Fri bod who will take great pleasure in highlighting any infinitesimal mistake you DARED make and how your supervisor has been made aware of this error!
That is what we spend too much time doing – paperwork.
Give me a system where we can nick someone and get back out after a couple of hours and I’ll show you a reduction in crime figures. Dont tell me it can’t be done, it can. The problem is the CPS and defence briefs want this system. It’s money you see!!
But I’m not bitter…….taking another tablet matron, yes!!
“Give me a system where we can nick someone and get back out after a couple of hours and I’ll show you a reduction in crime figures. Dont tell me it can’t be done, it can. The problem is the CPS and defence briefs want this system. It’s money you see!!”
Come to Australia. For p!$$weak, minor, not-serious and serious offences, the Police themselves do the prosecuting. Lawyers are only used for very, very serious offences. Having been road-coppers themselves, police prosecutors can infer an awful lot from what little paperwork is required initially.
A stock standard shop-lifter can be done in about an hour; a little longer for an arrest, a little longer again for a juvenile. The store security officer supplies the statement and the photograph, CCTV footage isn’t required, the word of the security officer is good enough (though if there IS CCTV footage, it’s gratefully accepted), a photocopy of your notebook interview and a couple of typed paragraphs onto a computer, a few tick-and-flick forms and that’s it.
If you think you can prove it, you can charge it. You don’t have to wait hours on a phone to consult a lawyer, you’re trusted to make the right decision (though, it will be looked at by the prosecutors themselves later on).
The joy of it is, that whilst you have the right to a lawyer, it isn’t provided for free. You want a lawyer present, you’re paying for it. So, 90% don’t want one and are happy to answer questions. Those that DO want lawyers, already know to not answer questions, so, there’s some typing saved for you.
So, you’re right, it can be done.
It was done before CPS. The Sergeant Station Officer at each station listened to the officers evidence of arrest and then decided to charge or refuse charge. It worked without too much bother from 1829 to the introduction of the CPS. I would spend roughly twenty minutes from receiving a prisoner in the Charge Room to charging and placing in a cell either for bail or detain until court the following day. Any officer who served through the fifties, sixties and seventies can confirm this.
The whole CPS scheme is a disaster and it’s main reason for being is to keep second rate lawyers in employment and also provide yet another opportunity for empire building by ‘paper tiger’ policemen.
SP.
The CPS is an experiment which has run its time.
The system before had flaws but the baby was thrown out with the bathwater.
The whole of the CPS budget should be turned over to the police, the CPS disbanded and local prosecution by the police restarted. In house lawyers should be available.
The CPS should only ever have been the tail of the system they should not have been allowed to become the dog.
The CPS are the main reason for the massive increase in paperwork over the last 25 years.
In the 1980s I could drive an area car for a tour of night duty, lock up and charge up to three seperate crime prisoners and by 2pm the day after they would have been tried and all the paperwork completed. The only lawyers involved were the defence and the Stipe.
It was a good system, it required some safeguards to prevent miscarriages of justice but the CPS has not helped in that regard at all.
Once again,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,There speaks the voice of reason !
Reason? yep….Going to happen? Nope!
Its a great system for Solicitors employment prospects, especially those on the low side of ability.
About a year after the CPS farce started the Chief CPS lawyer for London appeared on the local BBC News and said, quite rightly, that the better system would be the Police Officer in Case prosecuting (or instructing Solicitors), but HMG had decided that the CPS was the way.
I think he’s one of only 2 CPS employees I had any time for!
Is it a better system? No. I think that became clear to me once watching a CPS lawyer doing a Guilty Drunk and Disorderly at South Western Mags one day…..I think he bored us for about 20 minutes with the Brief Facts, as opposed to the Police’s “Found Drunk South footway Wandsworth Road your wosrhip, no trouble.” End.
Too true SP. With a good store detective who could write her own 991B I was back on the street within half an hour and that included fingerprints, photo, CRO 74 and 611 folder ready for a guilty plea.
And if they ‘did’ go not guilty I’d get a remand date and prosecute it myself.
CPS Pah! I spit on your CPS!
Bill.
Happy days Bill, ‘ Gone like our youth too soon’
SP.
This his how those Dinosaur policemen used to deal with it, not a pair of wraparound shades in sight.
.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eErzfz6NCs
Compulsory dodgy ‘taches?
Hey Buzz,
Talking of the facial hair. Our Superintendent made it known that he did not approve of the ‘tache’ and he ordered two of our number to shave them off.
We were coming up to night duty for three weeks so it was decided the whole relief would grow Pancho Moustaches and Elvis Sideburns. With the exception of our two female colleagues, the remaining two Sergeants and
sixteen Constables all came back on days looking like Mexican Bandits, there were a couple of youngsters who resembled Peaches but the point was made.
Ah Happy Days.
SP
Ha ha! That’s a classic!
The way Moustache officer was speaking “can you please moderate your language?” and “he is a parasite and a menace to society!”
… ahh.. and the days of frog-marching prisoners back to the nick!! Not allowed to do that anymore.. human rights, you see! Humiliating to the poor “parasite”.
Hmm.
What if you already had lamb chop burns and a Pancho Tache?
“With the exception of our two female colleagues”
I’ve worked with a few P.W.’s that had better Tashes than mine.
That is what we spend too much time doing – paperwork.
This is very true, However, I wouldn’t mind lots of paperwork for one decent job if the Courts were able to sentence properly. Persistent hardened criminals being arrested, processed, charged again and again when they should be doing astronomical chokey time a la our American Cousins..
ACPO again with no clue of what’s going on in the real world. I’d like to see them dealing with the dregs of society.
It’s been a breath of fresh air to see the notts cops going about the queens business. Well done guys. The ARU guys are fantastic. Keep up the good work.
My advice to all the halfwits who want to be famous for fifteen minutes (and thereby risk their livelihood) :
Treat people as you would treat your nearest and dearest should you meet them.
Behave as you would if attending a Remembrance morning service. I.E. with dignity and decorum.
Hold your tongue.
The resulting footage will be so boring, the camera crew will not return and seek prey elsewhere.
Thats what i said above. Im glad someone else see’s it the same way.
Most of us joined because we do actually give a shi*t and care about people.. even the nasty, smelly, drunk and homeless ones.
.
Well the answers simple next time someone from upstairs comes and asks for people to star in a TV programme just say NO. The programme is only being done for two reasons and that is to full fill the ego of the SMT who thought it a good idea and too get him/her the next rank, so they can say at interview what a great PR idea he/she came up with. They care diddle squat about you guys on the coal face just themselves and the next rank.
Keep safe and look out for each other becasue NO ONE else will
Television are paying Nottingham to allow then to do this. How much are they paying and where is it going.
Truth is, the public is squeamish, luckily most haven’t actually been in a fist fight since school so I seriously doubt people understand what reasonable force is needed to restrain people. I hear it every other night ‘five cops on one bloke?’ I stop and wonder if those critics have ever wrestled with a coked up, young and fit 20 year old who has a pain threshold on a par with a rhino…..
telegraphing Winsor2?
“Ministry of Defence cuts armed forces’ London allowance”
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-16697051
Utterly disgraceful… and quite possibly our turn next.
Question – are forces allowing cameras to boost their own fledgling budgets with incoming funds from tv companies? #just asking
Thought the latest episode was good, I was impressed with the beat manager who dealt with neighbourly dispute and the out of control youth. I do agree though that the pushing incident was out of order, if he thought he needed to do that, then why didn’t he arrest him? Not good!
Too right.
I have some specialist skills (not related to policing, but in public service ) so was asked to take part in a docu-something for TV.
My boss was less than chuffed that my response to his request actually used the phrase ‘you can f*** right off’.
Too right.
I have some specialist skills (not related to policing, but in public service ) so was asked to take part in a docu-something for TV.
My boss was less than chuffed that my response to his request actually used the phrase ‘you can f*** right off’.
This went up the chain of command till it got to HR who started using phrases such as ‘showing a lack of loyalty’, and ‘for the good of the organization. I made my views of the media and appearing in it known and offered to resign if they could show where it was in my contract that I had to do it.
They found someone else to take part, and it was a right royal stitch-up, with the participant coming across as a complete tit.
The organization shortly after issued a new policy where individuals would be subject to disciplinary action if they co-operated with the media. Yep, they made it the fault of the individual.
From the Times:
Police are failing to record antisocial behaviour offences, casting fresh doubt on the true level of crime, a report reveals.
They are also failing to identify repeat and vulnerable victims, despite the case of Fiona Pilkington, who took her life and that of her disabled daughter in 2007 after repeated harassment by yobs.
The report, by Her Majesty’s Inspectorate of Constabulary, was based on analysis of police crime records last November. It also found that one in four crimes written off by a number of police forces should have been recorded as offences.
Both practices mean that police crime figures are higher than those given by the Home Office, which suggest that offending has fallen over the past seven years.
Only five out of 44 forces were performing well in recording and identifying repeat victims of antisocial behaviour, the report said.
Nick Herbert, the Policing Minister, said: “Recording crime properly is vital if the public are to have confidence in the police.”
Every year, crime stats, same bollocks spouted across the board.
Unfortunately our numbers are being cut to the hilt. There will always be a gap somewhere and people will, regrettably, fall through the net. I hate to say it, but how can we prevent another Fiona Pilkington?? There are not enough officers on the ground to deal with all the jobs that come in. Its shameful, but true.
The weak and the vulnerable are at terrible risk because of the cuts to police – and all the cuts they are making elsewhere in the NHS and social services.
How about this country takes a good, hard look at itself and stop the blame culture. No-one cares about each other – neighbours dont even know each others names anymore.
This blame culture needs to stop. Sorry for the rant…. but the police cannot be everywhere all of the time.
The story of the Cat A prisoner being freed from his prison van just about sums up what is happening to law and order and how this government and willing it to fail. Privatise the prison service and this is what happens. Now a dangerous murderer is on the loose.. and guess who has to find him?? Oh, yes… that will be the police.
The police are already recording repeat crimes – they are all contained in the CAD system. All you need to do is write a report that tells you how many times person X at address Y using phone number Z has called in the last few months and voila.
You can then assign a NPT officer to go round ‘for a meeting’ get the full details in an appropriate fashion rather than having your reactive resources constantly chasing their own tails.
Unfortunately the police have very limited powers to deal with repeat low level offences as all we do is give them an £80 fine. Next week they are right back out there causing mayhem again.
Last week team nicked an 18 year old with over 30 recorded offences – that means that the police have done their jobs 30 times yet this person is still out there causing mayhem. There is a limit
Re the uproar concerning the Chanel 4 programme:
I am surprised at all the mentions this has received. If you dress someone up to look like a drain clearance operative with “T” shirt and overalls and allow him or her to display work tools on a belt, don`t be surprised if they fail to act as a British police officer should.
Hi Frank
Frank, What’s more harmful. Injecting H or smoking it?
Why have you got a problem with drain clearance workers?
Feeling a little ‘bunged up’ are we? Bit of the old retention?
The “pushing – the – drunk – and – coat – incident” wasn´t just out of order ( which it was, 100 %)
It was also INCREDIBLY STUPID to act like that in front of the cameras.
I can´t understand why anyone would speak to the media EVER, less even be filmed, but IF agreed to, behave like a Victorian Virgin looking for a suitable spouse. PRISTINE.
Seriously, why go look for trouble?
That said, I think the eps so far have been pretty good over all.
On another note, Damilola Taylor´s killer just for released early for the SECOND time. The young man is so afraid of prison that he blatantly defied his probation conditions last time he was released early .
So how soon will people get sick and tired of this charade and make their own justice?
With regard to the film crew at Nottingham Police. things could have been worse and they might have been with the GMP.
http://tinyurl.com/72l34on
I thought you were told to keep the shiny side up?
I saw that too. Wonder exactly how fast he was going, erm…………
hope the officer recovers and is able to return to work
well yes obviously…….
I hope that goes without saying.
All of Nottinghamshires ACP level officers are so naive that it defies belief! None of them have any affinity with Nottinghamshire or Notts people.
The programme ‘Coppers’ is, in my view, a tv version of this blog. The despair, frustration, desperation, lack of management support, pitiful sentencing, serial offenders, pathetic neighbour disputes and teenage fcukwits that they have shown, have all been discussed on here by serving officers and have now reached an audience of mops who have a fuller and better appreciation of the risks and frustrations that you all face. ‘Coppers’ simply exposes your plight to an even wider audience who haven’t yet discovered this blog. That can only be a good thing.
The bleating and bitching of DCC Eyre, simply shows him up to be the spineless, out of touch, plank that he clearly is.
I’d go along with that, but it does sound as though some of the coppers on Coppers might act a little more professionally..even if only in front of the cameras.
Bill.
Super programme. Didn’t go down well with muti-culti liberal zealots but did show the police as human and what scum, losers and welfare junkies they have to deal with.
Why should that be sanitised?
Can’t wait for an episode in Handsworth or Sparkbrook…
Same old moans and complaints from the top corridor again. I wonder if they recall what it was like on the streets, which have now become harder and more dangerous to police. Surely the CC must have given permission for the cameras to come in and film. Surely she or one of her deputies must have seen the final edit before they went out ! The media will always show what they want to show, and undoubtedly some things have been edited and put in for shock value…….surprsie, surprise ! I wonder what wasn’t shown in some of the programmes
It’s the most in your face, open and honest polcing programme I have ever seen. Tells it like it really is. Yes there is swearing and dark humour. It’s a coping strategy. The police and armed forces have been doing it for years and will continue to do so while they deal with what they have to.
Yes some things don’t show some officers in a good light but there is good and bad in everything. As usual, some of the top corridor look at the bad and forget the rest.
All I can say, is stop bleating. You let the cameras in, and they must have given you a brief of what they were looking for, so don’t be surprised. We all now what the media are like. One day your friend,the next day, biting the hand that feeds them.
Let the officers get on with work in an inceasingly failing society, and lay the blame at the door of those who have made the country the way it is……the politicians, media moguls, and the public, who live for reality fly on the wall programmes.
Be careful what you wish for, you may just get it !!
Don’t know if this is true
A motorcycle police officer stops a driver for shooting a red light
The driver is a real bar steward, steps out of his car and comes striding toward the officer, demanding to know why he is being harassed by the Gestapo!
So the officer calmly tells him of the red light violation.
The motorist instantly goes on a tirade, questioning the officer’s ancestry, sexual orientation, etc., in rather explicit offensive terms.
The tirade goes on without the officer saying a dickybird.
When the officer finishes writing the ticket he puts an “AH” in the lower right corner of the narrative portion of the ticket.
He then hands it to The ‘violator’ for his signature. The bloke signs the ticket angrily, and when presented with his copy points to the “AH” and demands to know what it stands for.
The officer says, “That’s so when we go to court, I’ll remember that you’re an arsehole!”
Two months later they’re in court. The ‘violator’ has a bad driving record and he has a heap of demerits and is in danger of losing his license, so he hired a lawyer to represent him.
On the stand the officer testifies to seeing the man run through the red light.
Under cross examination the defence attorney asks; “Officer is this a reasonable facsimile of the ticket that you issued to my client?”
Officer responds, “Yes, sir, that is the defendant’s copy, his signature and mine, same number at the top.”
Lawyer: “Officer, is there any particular marking or notation on this ticket you don’t normally make?”
“Yes, sir, in the lower right corner of the narrative there is an “AH,” underlined.”
“What does the “AH” stand for, officer?”
“Aggressive and hostile, Sir.”
“Aggressive and hostile?”
“Yes, Sir.”
“Officer, are you sure it doesn’t stand for arsehole?”
“Well, sir, you know your client better than I do.”
~~~~ How often can one get an attorney to convict his own client~~~~
In Coppers there was a man found on private premises sitting on a knife, with a screwdriver in his back pocket and a pair of scissors down his sock. The officer said there were no grounds for arrest. I appreciate we did not see the whole interaction, but is that not going equipped or possession of an offensive weapon?
He was in his own home.
You can’t nick someone for going equipped or for having a prohibited weapon in their own home.
Strange but true.
Actually, I think TDH is referring to a bloke the ‘beat bobbies’ found sitting in the garden of an unoccupied house. He was taken back to the nick for a drug search if I remember rightly, but was given a free pass on the Points/blades and Going Equipped for some reason?!
That confused me too. And that copper who found it weird that he came across someone with a snooker ball in a sock… Offensive weapon perhaps? :S
Yeah – maybe it happens less out in the sticks!
Snooker ball in a sock could be used for TFMV or a weapon I suppose
Oh yea of limited experience. Peter Stcliffe, The Yorkshire Ripper used a Snooker Ball in a sock to render his victims senseless. He used a hammer in his early attacks, and progressed to the sock and snooker ball in the majority of his attacks, especially the later ones.
Like Ray Winstone in Scum. (Won’t mean a thing to anyone under the age of 40!)
Don’t go into the greenhouse!
incidentally, ever seen what a bunch of keys on a length of lanyard does to a bouncer’s face?
I did recently, wasn’t pretty.
I expect a snooker ball/other heavy object in a sock would be the same.
is this a wah?
Both going equipped and possession of off weap cannot be committed in ones own dwelling. Off weap cannot be commited unless in a public place.
“The Police Authority was disturbed and alarmed by the behaviour of some police officers who participated in the first two programmes of Coppers. We have made representations to the Chief Constable about our concerns and we will continue actions to address and improve the culture and behaviour of Notts Police.”
And herein lies the glorious irony of all the nonsense diversity training we have had: police officers now see themselves as people too, people who are no longer prepared to take the kind of shite they get every day from the entitled classes.
Sigh. We really are expected to be robots aren’t we? Granted, courtesy goes a long way but when you’re faced with the same dickheads who swear, spit and try to assault you, day in day out; you’re entitled to tell them to, in no uncertain terms, fuck off.
“Sir, please drop that knife and stop trying to stab me or I’ll have to ask nicely again”
Dont lower yourself to their level, mate. Be the cleverer and better person. Trust me, it works.
If someone is trying to stab you, thats obviously an extreme example.
You are not entitled to tell anyone to F*** off. If you think that you can then do not have any witnesses to it, and then you will have to lie your way out of it. Don’t be too shocked at this as I have had to defend one or two officers in my life.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2091541/Whoops-Police-officer-wrecks-155mph-supercar-carries-2am-test-drive-public-road.html
“Icy conditions” Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
I don’t think this link has been posted….. but would appear worthy of comment in the increasing PC world of the PC.
http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/hampshire_policeman_drove_dangerously_as_he_chased_stolen_van_through_portsmouth_1_3449757
A stolen van drives dangerously, followed by Police pursuit trained driver in a pursuit car, but if he followed the van he must have been driving dangerously too….???? So he gets charged and is currently gripping the bar at Crown Court (Guildford though, so he should be found not guilty).
What i want to know is how the “officers on foot” managed to stop the stolen vehicle!!
I dont know what the force policy is for his area… but most farces have a “no pursuit” policy unless authorised from those above.
And the public wonder why……………………..!
It is always great to receive the full backing of your Force. The officer did draw a line when he refused to follow the Van through a railway crossing.
And if he had have blocked them in at Mcdonalds and the offender took to forcing himself out unconventionally risking public safety he would have been in the Poo for that as well,Obviously the prosecution have no idea how reckless these car thieves can be, they should start watching Coppers. Doh!.
If he is found guilty then surely there can be no pursuits what so ever or am I missing something?
Not been involved in a pursuit for a few years now. However in the early 2000′s I could see this coming a mile off. My Farce decided on a no pursuit policy for all but trained bod’s and even then if the pursuit got a bit iffy then it got called off, more often than not. I still saw some of the younger PC”s tearing around keen as mustard but without a clue of what might come.
Basically don’t put your neck on the line,not with the scummy thieves but with your very own SMT, coz they will have your job in a jiffy, it is simply not worth it.
Get there safely, don’t take risks, go home safe.
I have fainted….speechless!
Defense counsel just ask this one question of the prosecuting council. Where in the police pursuit driver training manual does it mention anything about ‘blocking’ a vehicle being pursued by one police vehicle? Ask them to show it to you. I bet they cannot. Case should then be withdrawn by the CPS.
sorry about the typo there between counsel and council. How can I get it right and then wrong? AZZ says, “Doh!”
Agreed old bean, but in police pursuit training, it is said that you mustnt use your vehicle as a static road block (unless the vehicle is stationary and you park in front of it)