The Polish builders know nothing. ‘We know nothing’ they say.
Waterloo Sunset. That’s the name of the song which reminds me of moving house when I was a kid. It’s just come to me. I stare up at them on the wall they are building. Four Five has just chased Geordie into the building site where the Polish stand like sentinels on the wall. They could not have missed seeing this. But they know nothing.
Their own country cannot offer them a decent living, mainly because of generations of people who ‘knew nothing’ and said nothing. Now they want to do it to us.
We put in a perimeter and I ask Control for a dog. There is one dog on duty in the County and he won’t come unless I can guarantee that the offender is contained. Sorry. How stupid of me. ‘Millions of people swarming like flies around Waterloo Underground’ I thought that was brilliant when I was a kid.
Two of the units I have on the perimeter are called away for a serious road crash on the Metro City Road, two vehicles, persons trapped, and ambulance at scene.
There are now four of us left to search 65 affordable homes, available by spring 2007. The Neighbourhood Sergeant joins me. He knows Waterloo Sunset. He remembers seeing a photo of Ray Davies in a plastic mac.
Geordie is eventually nicked elsewhere after he runs through the CCTV covered area of town. Theft and Breach of ASBO. His mother brings his prison bag. Even Geordie is convinced that he will go down after this, the third breach of his ASBO and a ‘bang to rights’ £300 theft from Boots. He doesn’t even bother to deny it in interview.
But he won’t of course. Go to Jail that is.
Next day I see him again by the bridge in town. He doesn’t know what he received in Court because he wasn’t listening. Even Geordie thinks he should be banged up. ‘I should be banged up’ he says. ‘What’s wrong with these people he shouts, pointing at the Magistrates Court ‘what’s the country coming to?’ he asks me.
‘Geordie’ I say to him, ‘Do you know Waterloo Sunset?’ he looks at me for a bit and says he doesn’t.
He doesn’t know, I tell him, what he has missed.
The polish, eh? On reflection I see what you mean. Although I half suspect the “see nothing” mentality is not restricted to the Poles.
I lived in Poland for over a decade. I have the distinction of having made perhaps the only “citizen’s arrest” in the country’s history (they don’t have the concept there, but who knew?).
Having spent a day with Gdansk CID in consequence, I can imagine why your Polish builders didn’t want to cooperate. I had quite as hard a time as the accused. In Poland your address is considered to be an official, public fact. If you complain of a crime or give evidence against a suspected criminal, he will therefore be given your address in the charge documents supplied to his lawyer. The criminal is probably registered at the demolished home of his long-dead grandmother, so if you fancy some counter-reprisals you are out of luck.
Your potential witnesses probably assumed you would do the same, exposing them to the wrath of the perp.
The Gdansk police were quite surprised when I suggested that this system might lead to people being unwilling to cooperate with the authorities. They were amazed to learn that in Britain, people are not required to be officially registered to an address and can live under a bush if they want.
One reason I stayed there so long was that they found my account of the criminal justice system in England so interesting, that they kept bringing in the next guy up the hierarchy to talk to me. I remember the most senior policeman in the city being very interested in the concept of convicted criminals volunteering undetected crimes to be “taken into consideration” on sentencing. If he ever makes Minister of Justice, I expect reforms along those lines.
I spoke more Polish that day than in the remainder of my time in the country and I certainly learned never, ever, to cooperate with the police. I got the last laugh, though. For his own nefarious reasons, I was registered to my landlord’s address, not the address of the house where I lived. So I happily gave that as my official address. I never liked him, anyway.
I rather think that the British Public are beginning to have the same view of our Police as other opressed nations have. How often we now hear of people assisting in the aprehension of criminals, or members of the public coming to the aid of the police only to find themselves under arrest? Far too often. People being arrested for diving into swimming pools tend to give one the impression that the Police have their own agenda, an agenda that no longer puts law abiding citizens first. Having a general discussion the other night with family and friends I can assure you of one thing. Unless things drastically change and we actually manage to re-establish a police service that is worthy of respect, more and more people will know nothing.
Thanks for your comments Tom Shaw.
Please tell us what you think that the Police’s agenda is and exactly what you would do to improve the Police?
What do you do to improve things?
My only agenda is to get my team and myself home safely at the end of a shift.
One of the shift got a needlestick injury last night. Now he faces a round of tests and the delay for the results. Telling his wife thay cant have unprotected sex until the results are in.
I am sure that was high on his agenda.
Tom, arrange a visit to your local station. Try to go out as an observer with one of the response shifts, some forces allow it. Perhaps you will get an insite into the unique nature of the job that we do with one arm tied behind our backs by the government and out own chief officers. Couple that with the fact we can only go as far and the extension lead for the computer allows nowadays. Perhaps then you will see the point of these blogs…
Tom Shaw, I know exactly what you mean, but it’s not the police that have their “own agenda”, it’s their political masters in the Home Office. Careful though the various police bloggers are to stay within professional bounds, it doesn’t take much reading between the lines to see that.
I feel for them. No-one joins the police force to give innocent citizens a hard time – and they have to live their off-duty lives in the same mess as the rest of us, unlike the people in their Ministerial Jaguars with their protection squads.
On the other hand, I am sorry to say that, until the political agenda has been changed, I would no more help the British than I would the Polish police, for the practical reasons you mention. It’s not their fault, but they are no longer policing with our consent.
Just like many NHS staff would never go to their local hospital (they either self-treat or go miles to a better one) most police officers would never call the police unless it was an absolute necessity. The public elect the government and the government have ruined the NHS and the Police with their ludicrous politically correct, target driven nonsense. The public get what the public deserve.
You say ‘the public elect the government’ and ‘the public get what the public deserve’ but have you looked at the choices the public get to elect, not really much of a choice. And while what they promise you may look good you can guarantee it’s never going to happen once they get into office. I personally would love to vote for a government that will look further ahead than trying to get themselves re-elected (and therefore be able to do something long term about the nhs, police, schools etc) but I haven’t yet found a party that will do this. Yes, I do realise this would probably mean I’d be worse of for a while but if promises were met it would be so worth it. People wonder why I didn’t vote for years but why should we have to vote for liars who’s way of promoting their party is to slag off the other party. I now vote in an attempt to keep the worst out of power.
Anyway, rant over. I think most police do a great job in difficult circumstances and I would willingly point you in the right direction if Geordie ran past.
We’re having an election here in Scotland in May (the 3rd, which also happened to be my birthday, incase you all decide to send me pressies). I’ve always voted, as I think that if you can’t be arsed getting to the polling station, then you probably deserve the government you get. The fact that most people don’t vote makes me think that most people don’t care, and won’t care, until it’s them who need the police, or an ambulance, or a decent school to send their children to. So this year my vote will go to ANY candidate to show me that they really are going to support public services. How to show it? If any of them admit that they’ll raise taxes to bloody well PAY for these services, instead of robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Waterloo Sunset – wonderful, beautiful song. What a genius Ray Davies was (is). I expect it is wasted on some of your ‘clients’, who would relate better to ‘Dead End Street’.
I am not entirely sure who will be left to pay the taxes if they do that, Trekkie. Bear in mind that almost a million jobs have been transferred from private to public sector under Labour. That’s almost a two million swing. I know public sector workers pay tax too, but that’s just “churn”. It’s only the private sector that can actually generate wealth. Now that there are no State Enterprises, the public sector is pure cost (some of it of course, like the policey bits of the police, worthwhile).
The reason the Government is casting about everywhere for odd sources of income is that the money is running out. Tax burdens are at historic highs and (were it not for debt-fuelled consumerism propping up the economy) would already have caused a crash.
I am afraid you must brace yourself for cuts. The danger is that the managerial bits of the public services will not select themselves for the chop, so that we can expect the front-line/sitting on arses ratio to worsen in the coming years.
jaegerdude Says: on March 3rd, 2007 at 3:04 pm
Thanks for your comments Tom Shaw. Please tell us what you think that the Police’s agenda is and exactly what you would do to improve the Police? What do you do to improve things?
@jaegerdude: As others have pointed out, the real problem is with the agenda given by this government. The police have just done as they were told. Very submissive, very short sighted or suffering from an excessive personal ambition and blinded to all else; I don’t know which.
What did I do to improve things? I have the misfortune to live in an area that has always returned an MP of another party, so my vote doesn’t have any influence anyway.
What this government has achieved is to completely demolish the principles of policing established by Sir Robert Peel. Now we have a police force whose role includes controlling the population, and establishing fear in them. Many in blue now appear (from the outside) to look down their noses at “civilians”. Do I not remember a time when the Police were proud to be “civilians in uniform”? Part of the community? OK, giving my age away now. And the fact that I am the son of a sergeant in the Specials.
A few years ago, I worked in an office overlooking a London High Road. Whenever the police went up and down that road, it was on Blues and Twos. The constant “get out of my way, I’m a POLICEMAN” gets very wearing. I think it was that experience, that finally turned me from being someone who would always do his bit for the civic good, report incidents, be prepared to give evidence, etc, into another who has taken the “Polish amendment” – “Me, I know nothing”. Now that the police generally behave as though they are an army of occupation, they had better get used to being the recipients of the simmering resentment that all armies of occupation get. Ask the British squaddies in Basra.
It was about the same time that it became an arrestable offence to look the wrong way at an officer. And fingerprints and DNA were to be taken from all arrested, not just convicted persons. Again a long time ago, and when the early stages of this breakdown were being justified by the predecessors of this government, it was being said that would-be criminals were prevented from going off the straight and narrow by the fear of detection, not by fear of the punishment that could be meted out. Now, every arrested person is treated the same way that a convicted criminal would have been treated in yesteryear. Is it any surprise that I will no longer go voluntarily to the police station whatever the cause?
Confirmed of course by the row by/about Ali Desai, who’s campaign to get himself promoted to Commander includes writing a book that would get lesser bloggers the sack! And then he gets it serialised on the eve of his promotion board! As the Mail asked, who’s afraid of whom? It is scandalous, well at least it would be if we lived in former times.
As the government will continue to drive things from awful to even worse, it might be worthwhile remembering that “I was only following orders” didn’t cut much ice at Nuremburg.
Sorry, we are miles (no, the PC BBC are using kilometres now), kilometres away from the original post by the Inspector. But its just another example of how things have gone so badly wrong its difficult to put them right in the life of one Parliament, even if the other lot were showing any inkling of wanting to. If only I were young enough to emigrate!
Worried seems to know a little too much about the arrest process, and to be just a little too upset about the nasty Mr Policeman! Me thinks he doth protest too much perhaps?
Sorry to digress., but do you realise that you have now over ONE THIRD of a MILLION hits?
Catching up with DC me thinks?
I can’t believe that the thing that put “Worried” off the police was the fact that they kept going up and down London High Road on blues. I am sure they were very sorry to disturb you, Worried, in your office, and should of course have made on silent approach with no lights, to whatever emergencies they were heading to, out of respect for all the people sitting safely in their officer not being attacked or robbed.
PS Meant to say – he must be one of the only people put off the police by them ATTENDING jobs. There are plenty of good reasons to hate us, Worried, but that ain’t one of them.
Every day I look at the world from my window and see the same stuff going on and the same irrelevance to the plights of others. Am I in paradise ?……………I think not somehow. We certainly aren’t submissive as suggested above, and some possess the ambition that shields a lot of common sense but allows just working ‘together’ to hit whatever targets and try to keep the wheels on. Trouble is we are keeping the wheels on with our fingertips because someone sold the wrenches because they made the keeping the wheels on more ‘efficient’. The wrenches stayed in the box whilst the new ‘finger’ approach was promoted before someone saw some sense and got the wrenches out and remembered that it made keeping the wheels on much easier. The wrenches got put away again because of some new adaption of keeping the wheels on, or at least the new plan told us, that was radical and allegedly the answer to our prayers, so the wrenches were not in keeping with forward thinking and sold off. Trouble is that someone realised that this was losing a sensible back up, not admit a mistake, they leased them back, just in case. If only we could see the bigger picture and we would be back looking through that window into paradise, not a wrench in sight.
Members of the public should not be afraid of helping the police and being a witness. You won’t have to go to court unless you filmed the incident on your phone and know the offenders full name and have five other people saying exactly (and I mean exactly) the same as you. The state controlled prosecution service won’t bother because the government have set them targets to reduce unsuccessful trials which is easy to achieve by not bothering. The amount of trials has reduced so much in the midlands that defence lawyers are starting to feel the pich financially. Ah well, every cloud…….
Dear worried! I’m happy to accept your label as an “army of occupation” to a point because if any other buisness/company tried to function under the demands and restrictions based on the arrest, detention and subsequent conviction and/or aquittal of their “customers or client base, it would cease to exist. Its not surprise that we think that virtually every section of society and the criminal justice society is against ue… BECAUSE THEY ARE!
But we still have the job to do…. We don’t have the luxury of turning a blind eye while we wear the cloth… or off duty for that matter… something you seem to forget.
For instance….. Thursday afternoon, one of my lot breaks his knee arresting a viloent thief. No one helped, they walked by and watched the officer writhe in pain as a few extra kicks were landed…. the first responding car turns up, three officers in it, take the crim down…. complaint? oh yes…. does it need four officers to arrest one man?
It does if you want a) safety, and b)corroberating evidence, we would also like a bit of c) public support…. like in other countries, where a violent criminal gets his come uppance! the public feel justice is going some way towards the victim.. NOT the perpertrator…. But Britain in the 2000’s is a laughing stock full of legal vultures who don’t see justice as a growth industry…. fast bucks! and the sight of a police oficer doing the parts of the job you don’t like to think goes on in modern Britain are our bread and butter…. its our world…. and it has never been rose tinted.
I was smashed to a pulp 10 years ago, my members of the british public… but it hasn’t tainted my view of you MR WORRIED…. unless your a criminal… then you deserve my contempt! Tell me what’s wrong with that mentality? shouldn’t people who hate criminals be in my job? I wish there were more of us!
I’m not afraid to tell the police anything I think will help, if not bang someone up, but at least build up a picture that will help bang someone up in the future. I absolutely HATE criminals, and if the poor little loves get a good thumping resisting rightful arrest – then good! Don’t they whine and winge, though? Of course, it was all someone else’s fault. Call themselves men? Insects.
I’m not too keen on lawyers, either, as I see them as totally amoral people who will argue black is white to make money even if their client is still holding the ax, standing over some poor unconscious sod who was just minding their own business. And that’s from someone who has a lot of lawyers as clients.
Knowing my luck, I’d stop to help the copper on the floor who is doubling up as a punch bag and get nicked for it.
However, I would help, as I couldn’t leave someone who is on our side getting a kicking.
No, I’m not a policeman, just someone who knows right from wrong and always tries to do the right thing. I’m sure there are more of us about…….
“Thursday afternoon, one of my lot breaks his knee arresting a viloent thief. No one helped, they walked by and watched the officer writhe in pain as a few extra kicks were landed…. the first responding car turns up, three officers in it, take the crim down…. complaint? oh yes…. does it need four officers to arrest one man?”
It’s a terrible state of affairs that people feel unable to help. Maybe they feel that were they to intervene and got attacked they’d get no support from ‘the establishment’. Or that the criminal would make a complaint against them and they’d end up being put through the mill because the figures have to look right for the guys at the top with no clue.
It ISN’T the fault of the guys at the sharp end, but a lot of the ordinary public have lost a lot of faith in the whole govt. “establishment” in general, and this _will_ cause a knock-on effect in how they support people who work for that establishment.
Personally, I’m glad to be well out of it, working in education now which has its own problems *sigh*. Still, I’d hate to have to try and arrest someone who didn’t want to be arrested these days but I like to think I’d still stop and do what I could if I saw someone attack a PC though.
I hope your colleague makes a full and fast recovery, TotallyUn-PC. Knee injuries hurt like the devil and can be a right pain in the hoop to heal properly
I would get involved, give chase, even provide a statement, but then I’m a police officer and it’s my job too do so just as much as an off-duty nurse or paramedic would render first aid at the scene of an accident. But by the same token I would not encourage any of my family or friends to do so, having seen the shambolic way witnesses are treated by the police and the way they are messed about in court and by the legal system in general, which is run for the benefit of 2 parties only – lawyers and scrotes. As for the public’s reported lack of respect and general disinclination to get stuck in if a police officer is getting a kicking [ not something I have experienced ] I believe we are paying the price for the craven acceptance by ACPO of this govt.s policies and agenda. If the police force stuck to law enforcement and gave up on the social engineering [ all those diversity officers back on shifts ] we ‘d be a damn site more effective and might start to regain the public’s respect.
Has anyone seen the old borough Police photographs, where all the ranks were present from the Chief Constable to the Constable. The people on the photograph would have been the entire Police Force for the town and surrounding area.
Those were the days when the four shifts would turn out a sergeant and 20+ bobbies, all of them working on the streets.
Now the Police employ more people than ever, with civilian support staff, Police officers and PCSO’s. So what has gone wrong where shifts struggle to turn out 10 in a busy town?
Whilst I am certain that there are still many fantastic Police Officers in the “Service”, here are some reasons why I would no longer give the police the time of day:
“Police ‘too busy’ to attend after attack on home – While a gang of youths tried to smash their way into an elderly persons’ residential home in Warwick, police said they were too busy to come and investigate.
Three helpless members of staff were working at Woodside in Spinney Hill when the building was set upon by the group at about 1.30am on Sunday morning.”
“Innocent have-a-go hero in cells for ten hours – As a former traffic warden and store detective with two police commendations to her name, Wendy Challis-Jones is all too familiar with tackling lawbreakers.
So when the 39-year-old spotted a man chasing a teenager who had stolen his bicycle, she instinctively waded in and carried out a citizen’s arrest.
But moments later when police arrived on the scene she was arrested by an officer on suspicion of assault. ”
“Police refuse to chase ‘helmetless’ bike thieves – A mother has spoken of her fury after police refused to chase her sons’ stolen motorbikes — because the thieves weren’t wearing helmets.
Pauline Nolan, of Droylsden, Greater Manchester, claims traffic officers told her they could not pursue the pair in case they fell off and sued the police force.”
“Boy banged up for booting ball – A BOY of 15 was arrested and thrown in a cell after his football hit a neighbour’s car.
Ashley Gallagher was sharing a kickaround in the street with his brother and pals when he says a gust of wind blew the ball into the new Vauxall Astra.
Owner Nathan Jubb called police, who nicked Ashley on suspicion of criminal damage.
The frightened youngster was read his rights in his kitchen before being taken into custody at Stroud police station, Gloucs. ”
“Police too busy chasing chickens to stop murder – A POLICE force failed to investigate properly the violent robbery of a showjumper which led to murder because its officers were busy inquiring into stolen chickens.
Documents obtained by The Sunday Times reveal Derbyshire police assigned only one detective to investigate the brutal beating and robbery of riding instructor Tania Moore, 26, in June 2003. She was attacked by a pair of thugs wielding baseball bats who had been recruited by her former boyfriend Mark Dyche. He went on to shoot her dead nine months later.
By contrast, the force deployed up to 40 officers, including an undercover team disguised as painters and decorators, to investigate the theft of chickens by staff from a poultry processing plant owned by a prominent businessman and former councillor, according to previously undisclosed documents.”
“Northumbria Police are refusing to publish details about three highly dangerous criminals on the loose, because it would infringe their ‘human’ rights.”
The list is seemingly endless.
It may not be the Officers at the sharp end who are ultimately responsible for the situation they find themselves in, but they are the ones implementing all of the above.
Respect is earned through actions, to many members of the public, “I am only following orders” is just not good enough.
Mr Smith,
“I’m only following orders” is good enough!
We are a disciplined service that has a rank structure and a disciplinary system that does not allow us to ignore a lawful order.
The days of discretion have gone
Dear me. Yes, the list seems endless and I too feel very let down by the stories I read in the media. I have met several police officers in various ways – when I was a witness to a crime, a victim and occasionally as my clients, and many of them feel the same way Inspector Gadget does about the ridiculous way in which the politicians have emasculated the police force in favour of wretched little scrotes and lawyers (as PC Copperfield calls them)
One thing that really gets me down is the real fear many members of the public have that they will be arrested if they try and help a police officer or try and carry out a citizens’ arrest. The politicians stance on this has alienated the police from the general public. Don’t they realise that ‘divided we fall’?
Enjoyed Tom Paine’s tale of life in Poland.
I also spent a long time in the country and could give a fair amount of interesting info about the role of the police there.
One small story.
I was with a friend in a local station reporting a theft.
While there, the officers asked if I wanted to help them, in another case, by taking part in an ID parade..
At that time, I spoke not a word of Polish – not even enough to speak my address in the correct form – but they weren’t bothered.
We went into a small room, same three plainclothes officers, my friend and me.
The ‘perp’ was then brought there as well.
The victim then came into the same small room and from one yard away was invited to finger his attacker.
Needless to say he didn’t.
What a surprise.
Good site!!!
Hazel
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